Jump to content

Welcome to the new Traders Laboratory! Please bear with us as we finish the migration over the next few days. If you find any issues, want to leave feedback, get in touch with us, or offer suggestions please post to the Support forum here.

  • Welcome Guests

    Welcome. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at Traders Laboratory such as interacting with members, access to all forums, downloading attachments, and eligibility to win free giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE Traders Laboratory account here.

Do Or Die

Divergence Trading Strategy- Advanced

Recommended Posts

typical desperate scammer... OT on other's thread, then plaster it with his own promotional material... he thinks he can do it because he is a paid sponsor. I think not. He is a sponsor in his own dedicated forum. It gives him no right to hijack other people's thread with his commercials. This just shows his untasteful unscrupulous character.

 

Hello to everyone. This is my first post on this forum. I know of about three or four forums overall, but I hardly ever look at any of them (including this one) because of all the dumb conversations. This thread here is a very good example. This person Do or Die feels disrespected because this other person Urma disagrees with his method of divergence analysis, so he goes on to attack him for his opinion. He accuses him falsely, for example saying that he claims to manage other peoples money, but when the defendant corrects him by saying that he only stated that he manages other traders, the attacker doesn't even stop to apologize because he's still in a rage for feeling disrespected about his divergence technique. And on top of this, other people are jumping in to attack this Urma person aswell, simply because of his opinion. IS THIS STUPID OR WHAT?!

 

Now, I don't know who this Urma person is or what he's selling, and it really doesn't matter. There are honest and dishonest business people in every aspect of this world. If you have proof that this person is one of the dishonest people, then state and show your proof with facts. Otherwise, don't judge and don't attack out of suspecion or prejudice. Also, when you falsely accuse some one of something and you're proven wrong, then have the decency to at least apologize before you quickly change the conversation (and hoping no one noticed your foul up).

 

Again, I'm not taking sides here. But I'm NOT blind either. It's very obvious when some one is out of line. And I can honesltly tell all of you guys here that are attacking this Urma person, that you're ALL out of line.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hello to everyone. This is my first post on this forum. I know of about three or four forums overall, but I hardly ever look at any of them (including this one) because of all the dumb conversations. This thread here is a very good example. This person Do or Die feels disrespected because this other person Urma disagrees with his method of divergence analysis, so he goes on to attack him for his opinion. He accuses him falsely, for example saying that he claims to manage other peoples money, but when the defendant corrects him by saying that he only stated that he manages other traders, the attacker doesn't even stop to apologize because he's still in a rage for feeling disrespected about his divergence technique. And on top of this, other people are jumping in to attack this Urma person aswell, simply because of his opinion. IS THIS STUPID OR WHAT?!

 

Now, I don't know who this Urma person is or what he's selling, and it really doesn't matter. There are honest and dishonest business people in every aspect of this world. If you have proof that this person is one of the dishonest people, then state and show your proof with facts. Otherwise, don't judge and don't attack out of suspecion or prejudice. Also, when you falsely accuse some one of something and you're proven wrong, then have the decency to at least apologize before you quickly change the conversation (and hoping no one noticed your foul up).

 

Again, I'm not taking sides here. But I'm NOT blind either. It's very obvious when some one is out of line. And I can honesltly tell all of you guys here that are attacking this Urma person, that you're ALL out of line.

 

Freddy,

 

Wow, logic, perception and understanding of the facts, the topic and the issues at hand.

 

Plain simple truth is a plus in any discourse - welcome to Trader's Lab.

 

Thanks for the note and the PM with your phone number. If it is convenient with you, I will call you a couple of hours after the open Monday and try and answer your questions. I welcome all honest queries and look forward to speaking with you.

 

cheers

 

Pat

Edited by UrmaBlume

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Dear Mr. Vendor, kindly read the first post (and this time properly), this is where the discussion supposedly started before you brought your mysterious indicators.

 

Mysterious? Maybe to you. The algorithms behind Cumuliative Market Delta and moving windows of order flow have been out there for some time.

 

Of course if the total depth of your research has left you with the idea that price/price divergence trading is a "...Trading Strategy - Advanced" then maybe you missed them. Such readily available formulae are only mysterious to "shallow drillers."

 

UrmaBlume

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mysterious? Maybe to you. The algorithms behind Cumuliative Market Delta and moving windows of order flow have been out there for some time.

 

Of course if the total depth of your research has left you with the idea that price/price divergence trading is a "...Trading Strategy - Advanced" then maybe you missed them. Such readily available formulae are only mysterious to "shallow drillers."

 

UrmaBlume

 

I will answer in appropriate thread http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/technical-analysis/5288-trade-flow-harmonic-trade-6.html#post133630

 

Requesting all to post material relevant to the threads only icon10.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Price based indicators compare price to price_trend, (not price to price). I'm not aware of anything offering a more optimal divergence signal than divergence from trend.

 

Under the topic, "The Physics of Price," consider that price is an object propelled by a force. With that as a given then a more optimal divergence would be a divergence between the path of the object and the magnitude of the force.

 

What you are talking about is a difference between the object and its path with no consideration of motivation.

 

UrmaBlume

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is better for me to withdraw at this point, after you've posted a reasonable refutation, that is quite eloquent btw, but does not disuade me from my own truth. Wiithdrawl is better for me, than pursuing where this would go from here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It is better for me to withdraw at this point, after you've posted a reasonable refutation, that is quite eloquent btw, but does not disuade me from my own truth. Wiithdrawl is better for me, than pursuing where this would go from here.

 

Thanks for the kind words.

 

Certainly you are correct in saying that price, raw price, is different from the treand of raw price but still the trend is calculated from raw price while the calculation of the motivator of price does not include price in any form as part of its inputs. Thus a difference between an object and a force instead of a difference between an object and one of its derivatives.

 

cheers

 

pat

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Update:

 

Exit VRSN at today's average price (33.60)

Tight profit stop for CMS(20.70), EOG(102.20) and NSC(73.40)

Hold comfortably DGX, AET, ETN, NSC, EOG; stop is recent pivot high on daily.

 

All calls in profit, except VRSN. So update dedicated to the technology that predicts peak/bottom with 100% accuracy.

 

Continued from the starting posts...

 

dgx, aet, cms, etn, nsc, slb, fdx, are in favor.

 

eog and etn somewhat dangerous.

 

No long signals, yet. All trades on daily charts only, because they can be conveniently posted in non-market hours. If feasible, I will try to post maybe few on intraday time frame such as 2-minute.

 

PS: Do not post in this thread the following, you are always free to start your own thread:

1. Charts with mysterious black-box indicators

2. Claims about profitability of a method without log of live trades

3. Please read the starting post, inclusive of these sentences:

"BTW, the 'advanced' word in title is more of a cliche"...

"I will be calling some signals live in this thread, so it will also serve the purpose of a journal..."

...I use the most recent pivot high, bar high or support as stop loss.

 

Shorts triggered in VRSN, DGX, AET, CMS, EOG, ETN, NSC, SLB, FDX.

Edited by Do Or Die

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Do or die,

 

+1 for diverging instead of confirmed divergence – regardless of between what measures the diverge is occurring. In all my years, I've heard very little comment (or posts) re the concept of diverging. I admire your perspectives...

 

Rationally, fully formed divergences look safer. In real life, they aren’t.

In the limited market conditions where I utilize diverg., the tested odds of payoff are better for my diverging setups than they are for fully formed divergences – even if I’m using a very short right strength on the pivots. So now in all mkt conditions where diverg is utilized, I go ahead and start building the position using diverging instead of divergence … tactical fitness…

btw, using diverging as we speak real time, just starting to cover some of the EUR shorts I put on last week (fwiw, it will probably be 24+ hours before the positions are fully unwound though...)

 

Do you use classical pivots for all but the current swing or does your method for measuring diverging not use pivots at all? Thanks.

Edited by zdo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:)

 

Great to see a fellow divergence trader. In every book and on internet I see the people going by the conventional way to confirm consecutive pivots, but by the time it is confirmed the risk/reward is already screwed.

 

"Do you use classical pivots for all but the current swing or does your method for measuring diverging not use pivots at all?"

 

See the attached example, I use the classic pivot in prices which may or may not correspond to the pivot in oscillator (the blue spike in lower pane indicates divergence). The typical entry is when market cuts the high of previous bar.

example.png.a0d74f14a951a8e0378e3249fc175040.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While we trade in much faster time frames than most of the references here, this morning, in ES, there was a classic double positive divergece in both the 8k & 5k volume bar charts.

 

As everybody here knows we believe that divergences between price and the buying and selling forces that propels price can often indicate change.

 

In the middle of the chart below you can see that as price (top window) makes a Lower Low, both the indicator of net trade and the indicator of the moving window of the balance of trade made Higher Lows which is referenced as a double positive divergence.

 

This divergence was verified and duplicated in the 8k chart:

 

Please click to enlarge image

tpt665.jpg

 

 

UrmaBlume

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If this Thread is about divergence trading then here is an expample of divergence from just a few minutes ago in today's ES.

 

Regardless of anything else it is a recent chart and it certainly shows a prime example of a divergence setup.

 

Please click to enlarge image

tpt2234.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Update:

 

For entry and exit, the average price (H+L+C)/3 of day on which the signal was generated is used to indicate performance, unless a stop is hit.

 

Closed Positions:

EOG (+0.8%),CMS(+0.6%), NSC(+1.6%), VRSN(-0.7%)

 

Open Positions:

DGX, AET, ETN, FDX, SLB

 

Update:

 

Exit VRSN at today's average price (33.60)

Tight profit stop for CMS(20.70), EOG(102.20) and NSC(73.40)

Hold comfortably DGX, AET, ETN, NSC, EOG; stop is recent pivot high on daily.

 

All calls in profit, except VRSN. So update dedicated to the technology that predicts peak/bottom with 100% accuracy.

 

Continued from the starting posts...

 

dgx, aet, cms, etn, nsc, slb, fdx, are in favor.

 

eog and etn somewhat dangerous.

 

No long signals, yet. All trades on daily charts only, because they can be conveniently posted in non-market hours.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FWIW I also see negative divergences against the rally back up to 1236. Ultimately the mkt rallied to 1244 before a noticeable pullback. Is that also a trade you would have taken?

 

While we trade in much faster time frames than most of the references here, this morning, in ES, there was a classic double positive divergece in both the 8k & 5k volume bar charts.

 

As everybody here knows we believe that divergences between price and the buying and selling forces that propels price can often indicate change.

 

In the middle of the chart below you can see that as price (top window) makes a Lower Low, both the indicator of net trade and the indicator of the moving window of the balance of trade made Higher Lows which is referenced as a double positive divergence.

 

This divergence was verified and duplicated in the 8k chart:

 

Please click to enlarge image

tpt665.jpg

 

 

UrmaBlume

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Scratch that question, Pacific time. I now see that indeed the negative divergence trade faded minimal heat from 1236 (to 1239ish) and also would have worked nicely.

 

My apologies Do or Die for further cluttering your thread.

 

FWIW I also see negative divergences against the rally back up to 1236. Ultimately the mkt rallied to 1244 before a noticeable pullback. Is that also a trade you would have taken?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Scratch that question, Pacific time. I now see that indeed the negative divergence trade faded minimal heat from 1236 (to 1239ish) and also would have worked nicely.

 

My apologies Do or Die for further cluttering your thread.

 

Thanks for noticing and the kind word.

 

Just about 30 minutes after the positive divergence shown above a Negative Price/Net Trade divergence triggered a bot I am testing and you can see the divergence and the 3 entries performed by the bot in the chart below.

 

The topic here is divergence trading, right?

 

 

Please Click to enlarge image

tpt668.jpg

 

 

cheers

 

pat

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@ Do OR DIE What are you trying to boast, prove or demonstte by posting a random set of numbers on a random set of stocks? Isn't this thread supposed to be about discussing advanced divergence strategy? You attack another poster on here, then you proceed to make the same mistakes, only in a different way. Just dumb. How about posting some charts of these supposed trades, showing the entries, exits and why they were taken, and showing why your method is superior to just trying to trade random divergent signals on standard indicators? Otherwise you simply waste your time posting all these random numbers, as that is all they are to readers here. Oh, it also destoys any respect people will have for you for anything you choose to post in the future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Similar Content

    • By millonmethod
      Hello everyone!
      I am an advanced trader, with many years of experience (about 15 years - 10 living exclusively from this)
      I am going to give you some tips that you must know:
      There are going to be many people who tell you that trade is easy, that with only crossiing a line  with another one you will win a lot of money.... and that´s not true.  No, Sir, reality is far away from that. Many people who start arrive here with the hope that someone "gives them" a free method, they watch youtube videos thinking that this will give them the "strategy" and in a few days they realize that it does not work for them - they lose money - and then They go looking for a new one ... and so on. YES, IT´S TRUE YOU EARN IN TRADING, A LOT. BUT THINK: for a few to win (10% + any BROKER) many others must lose (90% people). YOU MUST HAVE A MONEY MANAGMENT FORMULA ( you can email me) People study so many years to live on this, not because they are dumb, but to know what they do, when, and have absolute effectiveness. It´s very easy to get lost here: do not disperse, jumping from one to another strategy WILL NEVER give you money, it will only waste your time and make you nervous when trading. PEOPLE WHO CHANGE THEIR METHOD CONSTANTLY : LOOOOSE ALWAYS.   If you have the knowledge to develop it, take your time and do it.  Always try it first on DEMO for at least 2 weeks! If not: search to buy a solid strategy (no you tube videos pleassse ! Avoid losing money! ) This is like any business, it requires some capital to start (capital = money in the broker + solid made /purchased strategy) If you are lost: I RECOMMEND YOU NOT TO WASTE TIME IN YOUTUBE, JOIN PEOPLE WHO HAVE EXPERIENCE AND IF YOU ARE GOING TO BUY A METHOD ... PLEASE !!!! DO NOT BUY 10 BAD AND CHEAP METHODS, SAVE MONEY AND BUY ONLY 1 BUT EXCLUSIVE AND MUST ALLWAYS HAVE SUPPORT !!!!!  Do not buy Signals! They never keep up with constant profits! One week will win and the next will lose. Nothing that does not depend absolutely on you will give you the money you are looking for. And if you do not have a strategy (made or purchased) do not even try PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE: DO NOT USE REAL MONEY! AT LEAST 2 WEEK DEMO FREE HELP HERE!!!!!  IF YOU FOLLOW MY ADVICE YOU WILL BE PART OF THAT 10% WINNER, email me.
      Have a nice trading day
       
       
  • Topics

  • Posts

    • there is no avoiding loses to be honest, its just how the market is. you win some and hopefully more, but u do lose some. 
    • Date: 11th July 2025.   Demand For Gold Rises As Trump Announces Tariffs!   Gold prices rose significantly throughout the week as investors took advantage of the 2.50% lower entry level. Investors also return to the safe-haven asset as the US trade policy continues to escalate. As a result, investors are taking a more dovish tone. The ‘risk-off’ appetite is also something which can be seen within the stock market. The NASDAQ on Thursday took a 0.90% dive within only 30 minutes.   Trade Tensions Escalate President Trump has been teasing with new tariffs throughout the week. However, the tariffs were confirmed on Thursday. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports starting August 1st, along with 50% tariffs on copper and goods from Brazil. Some experts are advising that Brazil has been specifically targeted due to its association with the BRICS.   However, the President has not directly associated the tariffs with BRICS yet. According to President Trump, Brazil is targeting US technology companies and carrying out a ‘witch hunt’against former Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, a close ally who is currently facing prosecution for allegedly attempting to overturn the 2022 Brazilian election.   Although Brazil is one of the largest and fastest-growing economies in the Americas, it is not the main concern for investors. Investors are more concerned about Tariffs on Canada. The White House said it will impose a 35% tariff on Canadian imports, effective August 1st, raised from the earlier 25% rate. This covers most goods, with exceptions under USMCA and exemptions for Canadian companies producing within the US.   It is also vital for investors to note that Canada is among the US;’s top 3 trading partners. The increase was justified by Trump citing issues like the trade deficit, Canada’s handling of fentanyl trafficking, and perceived unfair trade practices.   The President is also threatening new measures against the EU. These moves caused US and European stock futures to fall nearly 1%, while the Dollar rose and commodity prices saw small gains. However, the main benefactor was Silver and Gold, which are the two best-performing metals of the day.   How Will The Fed Impact Gold? The FOMC indicated that the number of members warming up to the idea of interest rate cuts is increasing. If the Fed takes a dovish tone, the price of Gold may further rise. In the meantime, the President pushing for a 3% rate cut sparked talk of a more dovish Fed nominee next year and raised worries about future inflation.   Meanwhile, jobless claims dropped for the fourth straight week, coming in better than expected and supporting the view that the labour market remains strong after last week’s solid payroll report. Markets still expect two rate cuts this year, but rate futures show most investors see no change at the next Fed meeting. Gold is expected to finish the week mostly flat.       Gold 15-Minute Chart     If the price of Gold increases above $3,337.50, buy signals are likely to materialise again. However, the price is currently retracing, meaning traders are likely to wait for regained momentum before entering further buy trades. According to HSBC, they expect an average price of $3,215 in 2025 (up from $3,015) and $3,125 in 2026, with projections showing a volatile range between $3,100 and $3,600   Key Takeaway Points: Gold Rises on Safe-Haven Demand. Gold gained as investors reacted to rising trade tensions and market volatility. Canada Tariffs Spark Concern. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports drew attention due to Canada’s key trade role. Fed Dovish Shift Supports Gold. Growing expectations of rate cuts and Trump’s push for a 3% cut boosted the gold outlook. Gold Eyes Breakout Above $3,337.5. Price is consolidating; a move above $3,337.50 could trigger new buy signals. Always trade with strict risk management. Your capital is the single most important aspect of your trading business.   Please note that times displayed based on local time zone and are from time of writing this report.   Click HERE to access the full HFM Economic calendar.   Want to learn to trade and analyse the markets? Join our webinars and get analysis and trading ideas combined with better understanding of how markets work. Click HERE to register for FREE!   Click HERE to READ more Market news.   Michalis Efthymiou HFMarkets   Disclaimer: This material is provided as a general marketing communication for information purposes only and does not constitute an independent investment research. Nothing in this communication contains, or should be considered as containing, an investment advice or an investment recommendation or a solicitation for the purpose of buying or selling of any financial instrument. All information provided is gathered from reputable sources and any information containing an indication of past performance is not a guarantee or reliable indicator of future performance. Users acknowledge that any investment in Leveraged Products is characterized by a certain degree of uncertainty and that any investment of this nature involves a high level of risk for which the users are solely responsible and liable. We assume no liability for any loss arising from any investment made based on the information provided in this communication. This communication must not be reproduced or further distributed without our prior written permission.
    • Back in the early 2000s, Netflix mailed DVDs to subscribers.   It wasn’t sexy—but it was smart. No late fees. No driving to Blockbuster.   People subscribed because they were lazy. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone else is lazy too.   Those who saw the future in that red envelope? They could’ve caught a 10,000%+ move.   Another story…   Back in the mid-2000s, Amazon launched Prime.   It wasn’t flashy—but it was fast.   Free two-day shipping. No minimums. No hassle.   People subscribed because they were impatient. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone hates waiting.   Those who saw the future in that speedy little yellow button? They could’ve caught another 10,000%+ move.   Finally…   Back in 2011, Bitcoin was trading under $10.   It wasn’t regulated—but it worked.   No bank. No middleman. Just wallet to wallet.   People used it to send money. Investors bought it because they saw the potential.   Those who saw something glimmering in that strange orange coin? They could’ve caught a 100,000%+ move.   The people who made those calls weren’t fortune tellers. They just noticed something simple before others did.   A better way. A quiet shift. A small edge. An asymmetric bet.   The red envelope fixed late fees. The yellow button fixed waiting. The orange coin gave billions a choice.   Of course, these types of gains are rare. And they happen only once in a blue moon. That’s exactly why it’s important to notice when the conditions start to look familiar.   Not after the move. Not once it's on CNBC. But in the quiet build-up— before the surface breaks.   Enter the Blue Button Please read more here: https://altucherconfidential.com/posts/netflix-amazon-bitcoin-blue  Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/ 
    • What These Attacks Look Like There are several ways you could get hacked. And the threats compound by the day.   Here’s a quick rundown:   Phishing: Fake emails from your “bank.” Click the link, give your password—game over.   Ransomware: Malware that locks your files and demands crypto. Pay up, or it’s gone.   DDoS: Overwhelm a website with traffic until it crashes. Like 10,000 bots blocking the door. Often used by nations.   Man-in-the-Middle: Hackers intercept your messages on public WiFi and read or change them.   Social Engineering: Hackers pose as IT or drop infected USB drives labeled “Payroll.”   You don’t need to be “important” to be a target.   You just need to be online.   What You Can Do (Without Buying a Bunker) You don’t have to be tech-savvy.   You just need to stop being low-hanging fruit.   Here’s how:   Use a YubiKey (physical passkey device) or Authenticator app – Ditch text message 2FA. SIM swaps are real. Hackers often have people on the inside at telecom companies.   Use a password manager (with Yubikey) – One unique password per account. Stop using your dog’s name.   Update your devices – Those annoying updates patch real security holes. Use them.   Back up your files – If ransomware hits, you don’t want your important documents held hostage.   Avoid public WiFi for sensitive stuff – Or use a VPN.   Think before you click – Emails that feel “urgent” are often fake. Go to the websites manually for confirmation.   Consider Starlink in case the internet goes down – I think it’s time for me to make the leap. Don’t Panic. Prepare. (Then Invest.)   I spent an hour in that basement bar reading about cyberattacks—and watching real-world systems fall apart like dominos.   The internet going down used to be an inconvenience. Now, it’s a warning.   Cyberwar isn’t coming. It’s here.   And the next time your internet goes out, it might not just be your router.   Don’t panic. Prepare.   And maybe keep a backup plan in your back pocket. Like a local basement bar with good bourbon—and working WiFi.   As usual, we’re on the lookout for more opportunities in cybersecurity. Stay tuned.   Author: Chris Campbell (AltucherConfidential) Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/   
    • DUMBSHELL:  re the automation of corruption ---  200,000 "Science Papers" in academic journal database PubMed may have been AI-generated with errors, hallucinations and false sourcing 
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.