Jump to content

Welcome to the new Traders Laboratory! Please bear with us as we finish the migration over the next few days. If you find any issues, want to leave feedback, get in touch with us, or offer suggestions please post to the Support forum here.

  • Welcome Guests

    Welcome. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at Traders Laboratory such as interacting with members, access to all forums, downloading attachments, and eligibility to win free giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE Traders Laboratory account here.

Recommended Posts

I want to work through these channels---was wondering if anyone had some un-annotated charts for the 13th, 14th and 15th----my data doesn't go back that far.

 

I not sure how you get the data going back that far.

Edited by wilddog

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sorry to be a bit ot here but what is the significance of the thin break lines in some of the formation boxes in the attached TN chart ?

 

Thanks, Steve

 

The first bars of the two boxes with the pointed arrows are OB. Unlike other Internal cases, an OB is painted with a bordered yellow box.

 

Do you notice that some Stitches on the chart are not painted? Hmm...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The first bars of the two boxes with the pointed arrows are OB. Unlike other Internal cases, an OB is painted with a bordered yellow box.

 

Do you notice that some Stitches on the chart are not painted? Hmm...

 

I am not sure what the hmm is for. Once again it is software coding. TN uses a library of Spyders tools.

 

There is no mystery around this. If the second bar of the stitch has lower volume the software highlights this.

 

Remember the second bar of a stitch has higher volatility (range) , so you expect the volume to be higher.

 

HTH

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sorry to be a bit ot here but what is the significance of the thin break lines in some of the formation boxes in the attached TN chart ?

 

Thanks, Steve

look closer, one of them is outside bar.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cleaned up the "example of slow fractal" (see attached).Corrected some of the price and matching volume bars to have correct bar coloration.Added the slightly faster nested gaussians.I believe this is same fractal weighting used by jbarnby's in the 10-3-2012 purple thick down container(traverse).One interesting side note is the placement location of the "trough" of R2R of traverse.There is some comments by spydertrader where the location of the R2R traverse trough may be located starting on http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/technical-analysis/6320-price-volume-relationship-271.html post #2167.hth

If you look at the price pane interlocking fractals, look for FTTs. There are many ways to look at the price+pane picture that ultimately show the same thing. If you held through the pt2 to pt3 retrace, you should hold through the whole "fractal 4" snippet.

5aa711a9e87a0_fractal3patraders.thumb.JPG.7995b981e9e0e3556c5647506f57f87d.JPG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If you look at the price pane interlocking fractals, look for FTTs. There are many ways to look at the price+pane picture that ultimately show the same thing. If you held through the pt2 to pt3 retrace, you should hold through the whole "fractal 4" snippet.

 

Thank you for the example with the trading application comment. I just wanted to bring up that one might want to enter a trade near the first FTT in green. At this point what type of confirmation should we look for before we enter the trade short?

 

From the information that is provided I am having difficulty seeing change. How do we know, its R2R if we have not seen a breakout from the prior sequences container? Specifically a break out in price from the prior container, and the end of the 2B from the prior volume sequence.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
river you have been on this thread long enough to know that is a rhetorical question.

 

lol--wilddog, it wasn't meant to be rhetorical but it appears that it was.

 

-river

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thank you for the example with the trading application comment. I just wanted to bring up that one might want to enter a trade near the first FTT in green. At this point what type of confirmation should we look for before we enter the trade short?. ...
Finer events will give more fake reversals with better entry points, while coarser events will give less fakes with less optimal entries. You'll have to decide what works for you. A volume increase gives momentum, and means continuation, so generally yields better reversals. Remember that this method works more with an "anticipation" mind set, than with a "confirmation" one.
... From the information that is provided I am having difficulty seeing change. How do we know, its R2R if we have not seen a breakout from the prior sequences container? Specifically a break out in price from the prior container, and the end of the 2B from the prior volume sequence.
"The "2" happens in the area where the RTL is crossed, and except on the fastest fractals, in extreme pace situations, or news spikes, it should be preceded by observable decreasing volume and followed by increasing volume, on the fractal you're monitoring.

 

On a lighter note, your question reminds of a dialogue from the movie "Michael" :)

Are you with the angel?

 

Do you see an angel?

 

I don't think I do.

 

Then how could I be with him?

 

Well, we don't know exactly how it works with angels.

 

How it works? If he's in the room then you're with him. If he's somewhere else ...then you're not.

 

And that's why we can't see him now? He's not here.

 

Are you impaired in some way ...that I haven't noticed, Miss?

 

Ms. Winters ...has probably never heard of an angel living in a motel.

 

You think I'm full of shit.

 

No, no. Nothing like that. I don't judge these things. I don't decide what's real or not.

 

I've seen too many things myself. We heard of a werewolf in S. Jersey. We went there. To locate the werewolf.

 

In that particular case ...that person was convinced that the werewolf was in the room with us. They could see it, although Mr. Quinlan and myself ... We couldn't, but that doesn't mean it wasn't there.

 

Michael? Are you coming down, dear?

 

Yeah. Be right down.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Remember that this method works more with an "anticipation" mind set, than with a "confirmation" one.

 

I got the impression that once one could differentiate any kind of formations inside any chart assuming he knows well about price volume relationship, he will be able to trade with a "confirmation" mind. Of course, I am not saying that I could do it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Finer events will give more fake reversals with better entry points, while coarser events will give less fakes with less optimal entries. You'll have to decide what works for you. A volume increase gives momentum, and means continuation, so generally yields better reversals. Remember that this method works more with an "anticipation" mind set, than with a "confirmation" one."The "2" happens in the area where the RTL is crossed, and except on the fastest fractals, in extreme pace situations, or news spikes, it should be preceded by observable decreasing volume and followed by increasing volume, on the fractal you're monitoring.

 

On a lighter note, your question reminds of a dialogue from the movie "Michael" :)

 

Overtime it will change trust me, how long, no guarantees lol.

 

You followed up with a home run on this one. I always wondered how others viewed the trade off with entries from other time frames. Back when we numbered cycles, from Dry up to Peak, 0 to 1, with the 0-7-6-5-4-3-2-1-0 numbering system, I tended to get annoyed on what I viewed as a late entry, between / closer to the 7 point. But really I was trading based on confirmation which yielded less profit in turn for a "lower risk trade."

 

I am pretty sure I understand what you are talking about in the quote below. Would you be so kind to confirm if what I have made comments on is correct.

 

"The "2" happens in the area where the RTL is crossed, and except on the fastest fractals, in extreme pace situations, or news spikes,"

 

BTW I am putting a sticky in my office with your above comment. There are several very helpful ones that people have posted in this thread, and this is one of them.

5aa711ac0a237_fractal20320patrader27s_edits1.thumb.jpg.401d787714fb5caef7be29ccfa7a2856.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Overtime it will change trust me, how long, no guarantees lol.

 

You followed up with a home run on this one. I always wondered how others viewed the trade off with entries from other time frames. Back when we numbered cycles, from Dry up to Peak, 0 to 1, with the 0-7-6-5-4-3-2-1-0 numbering system, I tended to get annoyed on what I viewed as a late entry, between / closer to the 7 point. But really I was trading based on confirmation which yielded less profit in turn for a "lower risk trade."

 

I am pretty sure I understand what you are talking about in the quote below. Would you be so kind to confirm if what I have made comments on is correct.

 

"The "2" happens in the area where the RTL is crossed, and except on the fastest fractals, in extreme pace situations, or news spikes,"

 

BTW I am putting a sticky in my office with your above comment. There are several very helpful ones that people have posted in this thread, and this is one of them.

I'm tempted to say that you're correct with your examples, in the way I understand what you wrote. Annotations usually are more clear than words, and marking in letters the significant points (pt1, pt2, pt3, ve, m1, m2, ftt) is very helpful.

 

I also quote from today's Jack's posts, related to our current discussion:

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=3734007#post3734007

 

...

 

There are many levels of trading. When a person gets beyond beginner to intermediate, he is able to differentiate between indicators and market signals found on indicators or their "derivatives" (not in the sense of calculus but in the sense of "are derived on the basis of").

 

Beginner levels of trading deal with risk management and money mnagement. Stops are also part of this imperfect knowledge and skill.

 

Advanced beginners probably stick to things like "confirmation"

 

At some p[oint in skill development traders swith from entry/exit skill level trading to hold/reversal trading. this is just a statement regarding risk; as risk is minimized by added knowledge and skills, then reversing is preferred over sidelining. At this point the trader is well aware that exit and entry are an identity except for sentiment orientation.

 

At an expert level all these are deemed not required. the reason is that there are aspects of Systems Analysis(SA) that step in to take the place of "trendfollowing" a lagging orientation) to be able to monitor and analysis in the Present or more expert to anticipate (a place slightly ahead of the Present and located in the future) while monitoring and analyzing the "NEXT" event in the trend.

 

A part of potfolio management addresses quality assurance. therefore, many instuments and tools of analysis have the adjective "future" associated with them.

 

I use the word "leading" with respect to events of trends..

 

...

 

http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&postid=3734100#post3734100

 

Trading is a decision making process. Trading decisions are made in the Present.

 

potential traders do what they do. One common thing is using stops. As knowledge and skill increases; the potential trader becomes a trader and around that time he no longer wastes time deciding on a stop value because he knows they no longer work because of his position size.

 

another common thing is setting targets. A potential trader stops setting targets as he becomes a trader and recognizes that trading is a bar-by-by routine. As the tradr grows, he move to view markets in an anticiaptory mode. Anticipation is "event" oriented and there is always the "NEXT" event taking place as the future moves into the Present. For me "I know that I know" the event is there aand I watch it come into the Present to optimize my carving the turn.

 

...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This Traverse contained LOTS of good learning material. I hope some will find this example helpful.

 

Thanks for showing the correct Traverse in your chart.

 

On your B2B gaussian from 14:45 (2/15) to 11:25 (2/19), could you give some clues why:

 

(1) The trough of B2B is not on any increasing black volume bar such as 15:35 (2/15) but on 11:25 (2/17)? Is it because prior Red Traverse RTL was not broken out yet?

 

(2) The last bar of B2B is not on 09:55 (2/19) or 10:45 (2/19) but on 11:25 (2/19).

 

TIA.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks for showing the correct Traverse in your chart.

 

On your B2B gaussian from 14:45 (2/15) to 11:25 (2/19), could you give some clues why:

 

(1) The trough of B2B is not on any increasing black volume bar such as 15:35 (2/15) but on 11:25 (2/17)? Is it because prior Red Traverse RTL was not broken out yet?

 

(2) The last bar of B2B is not on 09:55 (2/19) or 10:45 (2/19) but on 11:25 (2/19).

 

TIA.

 

As spyder wrote previously on this thread, to get to pt 2 of a tape (or any fractal) you need a faster fractal container. If you think pt 2 of a tape (b2b) can be on the 0955 bar (02/19) then you're not handling VE's properly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

jack hersheyActive Member

New

PointOne said:

Jack

please would you clarify your:

 

"A trend moves forward by measures (11) in the independent variable (you steer and focus from one to the next). these have "correspondences" to events (10) in the dependent variable which you hold through."

 

...and how these measures and events
map
to markets' R2RBR / B2BRB PV sequences (on 3 fractals)?

Soon I will begin a trading journal
. You show
three independent variable elements in R2R B R. One each of these the sub has 3 also. # x # = 9. In the last sub, two more elements are possible (3 x 3) + 2. That is 11 for volume
. The 10 cases of the dependent variable probably seem unimportant since the independent variable dictates the profit taking on price the dependent variable.

 

BUT..........

 

There is an issue of the sequence of requirements to measure and just when measuring can be done. I feel the OP will explain how the neurobiology of the mind works at some point. As it stands now anyone can do anything they want and we know the consequences.

 

And as you see my constantly lurking detractors show how envy combines with indignation which relly fucks up the mind function permanently.

 

The dependent variable DOES HAVE a JOB. It gates and kills measurement in the independent variable. this is "entwining" of trend forwarding. There are five strands involved as it turns out.

 

The important price cases are the only ones that make money. they "cast" shadows on subsequent price activity. SOOOO.... as a consequence (consequences are very important where a potential trader is focussed on "learning failure") (this may be explained as well by the OP), no measurement of trend forwrding is possible during the "shadowing" periods. Price squishes these out of the picture.

 

An expert senses by three operators: space, shapes, and movement. So I have mathematically articulated 21 elements that cover the entwining of five streams of "stuff"

 

I ask that people work to build their minds so that they have inference to use with the sensing operators. I wrote this out years ago in "Dr. Hu". There neurobiological "picture" of snsing and inference to obtain preception was introduced to the public formally at that time. Diagramatically you can see the iterative refinment positive feedback loops for becoming fully differentiated.

 

Experience affords this fully differentiated spectrum.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Are the two additional elements brought about after a VE?

 

Look up m1,m2

 

There used to be a thread on ET called "The Documents by Jack Hershey" and "Iterative Refinement"

 

It looks like all of Spyders threads on ET are gone.

 

An m1,m2 resolves a VE, after a VE you expect a non-dom and then back to dom. You can post on ET and Jack will respond with an explanation. He lives for this stuff :)

 

 

HTH

Edited by wilddog

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Are the high lighted areas M1 and M2? On my chart I have the last 2R leg, which has a full cycle and two extra volume cycles.

 

m1m2 is over one to two bars not a range of bars. For example if looking at a single bar case; part of the bar would be black and the other part would be red.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Date: 11th July 2025.   Demand For Gold Rises As Trump Announces Tariffs!   Gold prices rose significantly throughout the week as investors took advantage of the 2.50% lower entry level. Investors also return to the safe-haven asset as the US trade policy continues to escalate. As a result, investors are taking a more dovish tone. The ‘risk-off’ appetite is also something which can be seen within the stock market. The NASDAQ on Thursday took a 0.90% dive within only 30 minutes.   Trade Tensions Escalate President Trump has been teasing with new tariffs throughout the week. However, the tariffs were confirmed on Thursday. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports starting August 1st, along with 50% tariffs on copper and goods from Brazil. Some experts are advising that Brazil has been specifically targeted due to its association with the BRICS.   However, the President has not directly associated the tariffs with BRICS yet. According to President Trump, Brazil is targeting US technology companies and carrying out a ‘witch hunt’against former Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, a close ally who is currently facing prosecution for allegedly attempting to overturn the 2022 Brazilian election.   Although Brazil is one of the largest and fastest-growing economies in the Americas, it is not the main concern for investors. Investors are more concerned about Tariffs on Canada. The White House said it will impose a 35% tariff on Canadian imports, effective August 1st, raised from the earlier 25% rate. This covers most goods, with exceptions under USMCA and exemptions for Canadian companies producing within the US.   It is also vital for investors to note that Canada is among the US;’s top 3 trading partners. The increase was justified by Trump citing issues like the trade deficit, Canada’s handling of fentanyl trafficking, and perceived unfair trade practices.   The President is also threatening new measures against the EU. These moves caused US and European stock futures to fall nearly 1%, while the Dollar rose and commodity prices saw small gains. However, the main benefactor was Silver and Gold, which are the two best-performing metals of the day.   How Will The Fed Impact Gold? The FOMC indicated that the number of members warming up to the idea of interest rate cuts is increasing. If the Fed takes a dovish tone, the price of Gold may further rise. In the meantime, the President pushing for a 3% rate cut sparked talk of a more dovish Fed nominee next year and raised worries about future inflation.   Meanwhile, jobless claims dropped for the fourth straight week, coming in better than expected and supporting the view that the labour market remains strong after last week’s solid payroll report. Markets still expect two rate cuts this year, but rate futures show most investors see no change at the next Fed meeting. Gold is expected to finish the week mostly flat.       Gold 15-Minute Chart     If the price of Gold increases above $3,337.50, buy signals are likely to materialise again. However, the price is currently retracing, meaning traders are likely to wait for regained momentum before entering further buy trades. According to HSBC, they expect an average price of $3,215 in 2025 (up from $3,015) and $3,125 in 2026, with projections showing a volatile range between $3,100 and $3,600   Key Takeaway Points: Gold Rises on Safe-Haven Demand. Gold gained as investors reacted to rising trade tensions and market volatility. Canada Tariffs Spark Concern. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports drew attention due to Canada’s key trade role. Fed Dovish Shift Supports Gold. Growing expectations of rate cuts and Trump’s push for a 3% cut boosted the gold outlook. Gold Eyes Breakout Above $3,337.5. Price is consolidating; a move above $3,337.50 could trigger new buy signals. Always trade with strict risk management. Your capital is the single most important aspect of your trading business.   Please note that times displayed based on local time zone and are from time of writing this report.   Click HERE to access the full HFM Economic calendar.   Want to learn to trade and analyse the markets? Join our webinars and get analysis and trading ideas combined with better understanding of how markets work. Click HERE to register for FREE!   Click HERE to READ more Market news.   Michalis Efthymiou HFMarkets   Disclaimer: This material is provided as a general marketing communication for information purposes only and does not constitute an independent investment research. Nothing in this communication contains, or should be considered as containing, an investment advice or an investment recommendation or a solicitation for the purpose of buying or selling of any financial instrument. All information provided is gathered from reputable sources and any information containing an indication of past performance is not a guarantee or reliable indicator of future performance. Users acknowledge that any investment in Leveraged Products is characterized by a certain degree of uncertainty and that any investment of this nature involves a high level of risk for which the users are solely responsible and liable. We assume no liability for any loss arising from any investment made based on the information provided in this communication. This communication must not be reproduced or further distributed without our prior written permission.
    • Back in the early 2000s, Netflix mailed DVDs to subscribers.   It wasn’t sexy—but it was smart. No late fees. No driving to Blockbuster.   People subscribed because they were lazy. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone else is lazy too.   Those who saw the future in that red envelope? They could’ve caught a 10,000%+ move.   Another story…   Back in the mid-2000s, Amazon launched Prime.   It wasn’t flashy—but it was fast.   Free two-day shipping. No minimums. No hassle.   People subscribed because they were impatient. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone hates waiting.   Those who saw the future in that speedy little yellow button? They could’ve caught another 10,000%+ move.   Finally…   Back in 2011, Bitcoin was trading under $10.   It wasn’t regulated—but it worked.   No bank. No middleman. Just wallet to wallet.   People used it to send money. Investors bought it because they saw the potential.   Those who saw something glimmering in that strange orange coin? They could’ve caught a 100,000%+ move.   The people who made those calls weren’t fortune tellers. They just noticed something simple before others did.   A better way. A quiet shift. A small edge. An asymmetric bet.   The red envelope fixed late fees. The yellow button fixed waiting. The orange coin gave billions a choice.   Of course, these types of gains are rare. And they happen only once in a blue moon. That’s exactly why it’s important to notice when the conditions start to look familiar.   Not after the move. Not once it's on CNBC. But in the quiet build-up— before the surface breaks.   Enter the Blue Button Please read more here: https://altucherconfidential.com/posts/netflix-amazon-bitcoin-blue  Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/ 
    • What These Attacks Look Like There are several ways you could get hacked. And the threats compound by the day.   Here’s a quick rundown:   Phishing: Fake emails from your “bank.” Click the link, give your password—game over.   Ransomware: Malware that locks your files and demands crypto. Pay up, or it’s gone.   DDoS: Overwhelm a website with traffic until it crashes. Like 10,000 bots blocking the door. Often used by nations.   Man-in-the-Middle: Hackers intercept your messages on public WiFi and read or change them.   Social Engineering: Hackers pose as IT or drop infected USB drives labeled “Payroll.”   You don’t need to be “important” to be a target.   You just need to be online.   What You Can Do (Without Buying a Bunker) You don’t have to be tech-savvy.   You just need to stop being low-hanging fruit.   Here’s how:   Use a YubiKey (physical passkey device) or Authenticator app – Ditch text message 2FA. SIM swaps are real. Hackers often have people on the inside at telecom companies.   Use a password manager (with Yubikey) – One unique password per account. Stop using your dog’s name.   Update your devices – Those annoying updates patch real security holes. Use them.   Back up your files – If ransomware hits, you don’t want your important documents held hostage.   Avoid public WiFi for sensitive stuff – Or use a VPN.   Think before you click – Emails that feel “urgent” are often fake. Go to the websites manually for confirmation.   Consider Starlink in case the internet goes down – I think it’s time for me to make the leap. Don’t Panic. Prepare. (Then Invest.)   I spent an hour in that basement bar reading about cyberattacks—and watching real-world systems fall apart like dominos.   The internet going down used to be an inconvenience. Now, it’s a warning.   Cyberwar isn’t coming. It’s here.   And the next time your internet goes out, it might not just be your router.   Don’t panic. Prepare.   And maybe keep a backup plan in your back pocket. Like a local basement bar with good bourbon—and working WiFi.   As usual, we’re on the lookout for more opportunities in cybersecurity. Stay tuned.   Author: Chris Campbell (AltucherConfidential) Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/   
    • DUMBSHELL:  re the automation of corruption ---  200,000 "Science Papers" in academic journal database PubMed may have been AI-generated with errors, hallucinations and false sourcing 
    • Does any crypto exchanges get banned in your country? How's about other as Bybit, Kraken, MEXC, OKX?
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.