Pranks and Pranksters - Wanksters?

[Ingot54 13]

During the week and Australian Radio Station, (reported by the ABC to be Southern Cross Austereo (SCA) and 2Day FM) phoned the London Hospital where Prince William's wife Kate, Duchess of Cambridge, is being treated for a minor pregnancy complication, morning sickness.

 

Fraudulently, they pretended to be HRH Queen Elizabeth, the Queen of Australia. (It was fraud - check the definition)

 

Through this fraud, they obtained something that was not intended for them - private information, from which they hoped to gain status, and ratings for their programme.

 

The London Hospital was embarrassed, the nurse was embarrassed, and reprimanded. The nurse at the switch board was embarrassed and reprimanded. The Board of the hospital was embarrassed.

 

All around, people suffered loss of face, and as well, information that is a private family matter was strewn all over the world.

 

Childish and intellectually retarded behaviour by the Australians doing this.

Today I am ashamed to be called an Australian, and I distance myself diametrically from any such behaviour and mentality.

 

The Radio station apologised because of the immense public backlash yesterday, Friday 7th December 2012.

 

Yet on their web page, it was reported that they were still congratulating themselves with virtual back-slapping and high-fives for the "coup."

 

Some apology!

 

This morning it is with great grief and anger that I report that the unfortunate nurse, who took that call, has been found dead.

 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-12-08/nurse-who-took-kate-prank-call-found-dead/4416348

 

I am angry beyond words.

 

This person at the switchboard, took the call, and put it through to the nurse's station. The nurse took the call, believing what she was told - the Queen is inquiring about Kate.

 

She gave out general information, in good faith.

 

This is a simple case of unintended consequences.

An act of fraud has resulted in a death.

That is manslaughter, in my view.

 

I seriously doubt there will be justice done here.

We will see damage control measures ... but life will go on, and I expect the perpetrators will be allowed to do these stunts again.

After all we live in a society where money and status are valued above human life.

 

If you doubt this, then simply observe what now ensues.

 

We have fraud ... leading to a crime ... leading to manslaughter ... leading ... ?Justice? Charges?

 

And who will now support that young family?

 

I hope the two DJ's are very proud of their wanking work. Cheap laughs. Fun.

 

Tragedy.

 

Heartless, opportunistic parasites who sought to profit at the embarrassment of others, obtained information by fraud, leading to a death.

 

I can't add more - maybe you can.

[SIUYA 11]

First its a tragic result of what started out as a practical joke, whereby the consequences were certainly unintended, and if you listen to the actual transcript appears to be a long shot that actually came off.

i had a discussion on this with some friends last night.....it does raise some interesting dilemmas/questions.

 

For me too often these matters get blown out of proportion and the real issues or remedy does not appear as too many people look for scapegoats or the blame game.

 

As I see it - the DJs job is to do generally inane, silly pranks, pointless discussions and such. They are not some high end intellectual discussion group, they are light entertainment. As such this is the exact thing they are expected to do.

In this case they did not even think they would get through, then get put through, or then even get a response other than - sorry we dont give out personal information like that over the phone.

Hence it was one of those things that just happen....the perfect storm for a prank.

 

At this stage, surely the person who monitors the program as I thought they usually have a delay button to stop swearing, or other such things - this was when they step in and say - sorry gone too far...this should not have happened.

"The prank call was pre-recorded and vetted by lawyers before being broadcast to listeners in Sydney. (http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/kate-middleton-prank-call-receptionist-1478123)

 

Equally so - the hospital never should have said anything other than "sorry we dont give out that information"

How many of us have had the hassle of trying to get information over the phone only to get this response?

 

I think this is very different to driving at excessive speed, firing guns in the air etc that might lead to manslaughter charges - and certainty hope we dont go into a world whereby any action might lead to manslaughter charges should something go wrong....

eg; a man cannot pay off his mortgage and his business goes bust - he commits suicide - let us charge anyone related to giving him the mortgage, who pulled their customer account from his business etc;

 

Drawing a long bow of course - but the point is the same - calling for manslaughter charges in this instance does nothing to help anyone, and only inflames the situation with more emotion.

 

If everyone committed suicide due to embarrassmnet we would not survive long as a species - unfortuantely this lady might have had other issues in her life. OR untill they determine the cause of death it may have been a mistake of her own of taking too many sleeping pills, or anti depressants - we dont know and should not speculate as to who is too blame until the facts are revealed.

We also then have the role of the British media - did the embarrassment come from the prank itself or the outrage of the invasion of privacy and the lack of proper process revealed by the prank.

What about the role of the social media allowing this to be broadcast around the world.....

 

Even on a CNN report

"But Prince Charles himself joked about the incident after being contacted by the radio station. News of the prank was also widely shared on social networks, with at least 5,000 links created and shared between Tuesday and Thursday.

At the time, royal commentator Robert Jobson said he did not believe the radio call had been intended as a serious invasion of privacy."

 

Would the embarrasment have been the same, or the media response been the same had the patient been a politicians wife, or a footballers wife as opposed a royal??

 

While the end result is a tragic end, I hope we dont continue down the path the world seems to be going, of mob rule, rules for some and not others etc;....Ingot, and all those who send the hate mail to the DJs - -should we charge you with manslaughter if one of those DJs becomes so depressed they then kill themselves?

[TheDude 10]

Exactly. Some chick over reacted and took her life. That's sad, but you cant blame the DJ's for that, or the radio station or anyone else. To top her self over this issue only suggests she had other unresolved issues in her life.

 

Again, sad and unfortunate, but time to move on.

 

"Shit happens" Anon.

[MightyMouse 12]

Hospital attention for morning sickness? Give me a fucking break.

 

It's a shame that anything "royal" is of interest to anyone. The " royal" family thrives on "royal" attention. And, there is no end to the attention that the populace is willing to give.Cease and make them fad away like an old Sgt Pepper's album cover.

[Tams 20]

the royal family must have given her the 3rd degree, she had no choice but...

[SIUYA 11]

It's a shame that anything "royal" is of interest to anyone. The " royal" family thrives on "royal" attention. And, there is no end to the attention that the populace is willing to give.Cease and make them fad away like an old Sgt Pepper's album cover.

 

at least they have some history behind them --- its a bit more palatable than the Kardashians :haha: - and I am a republican (not necessarily in the US political sense)

[MightyMouse 12]

at least they have some history behind them --- its a bit more palatable than the Kardashians :haha: - and I am a republican (not necessarily in the US political sense)

 

Come on now. They have lively debate on whether to call a guy, they met, back or not. Such topics are so difficult to figure out by one's self.

[Ingot54 13]

First its a tragic result of what started out as a practical joke, whereby the consequences were certainly unintended ...

 

Ingot, and all those who send the hate mail to the DJs - -should we charge you with manslaughter if one of those

DJs becomes so depressed they then kill themselves?

I appreciate all of your commentary, Siuya. Certainly none of what you say is outside of what I have considered.

 

If the two DJ's did nothing wrong, then why would they be more upset than anyone else over this tragedy?

If they did nothing wrong, then there is nothing to worry about ... right?

 

No, we should not be charging me with manslaughter "if one of those DJs becomes so depressed they

then kill themselves."

 

These two actually perpetrated a fraud. They made false representations in order to obtain something that

they were not entitled to. That is, the private property - information - that belonged to someone else, and

which they had no right to. The law says that is fraud, and fraud is a crime.

 

Am I wrong so far? The intention (a prank ... or to to steal further property) is only considered by a court

in determining the severity of the sentence - the fact of the crime remains. A conviction might be recorded

with a probation or no penalty yada yada.

 

My crime is that I have stood back with indignation and outrage, and pointed the finger in anger.

That is because I AM angry. If they didn't make that fraudulent call, that woman lives.

 

The mention of manslaughter may have been over the top in the OP ... yet an unintended death as

a result of a crime can be construed that way by a court.

 

Look - to stand by and say nothing can also be construed as condoning an action. If people do not stand

up when serious issues arise, then these things proceed to a point where lines get crossed and people

seriously get hurt. If you want to take the mickey out of someone, then their innocence needs to be

considered, as well as the consequences.

 

It was very reasonable to foresee that someone might lose their job at that hospital. Is that funny?

Then what follows a dismissal from employment? That is also not funny.

 

Five minutes of fun to result in a possible unemployment ... that was foreseeable.

 

Is this one of those points of reference?

 

I believe now is a good time to draw a line in the sand.

 

DJ's and others in public life need to learn to become a little more creative if they wish to entertain and amuse

with comic relief. Cheap shots really are not funny.

 

Personally I object to my taxes being used by the ABC (Australia) to fund such drivel as "The Chasers."

It is unwatchable and a waste of resources.

[Yorkid 10]

Ingot54 -

 

I share your anger over this.

 

It just happens that I'm reading Robert Tressells's "The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists". In the scheme of things that Owen, his main protagonist outlines, royals and disk jockeys would fall into the same category of non-productive individuals who go to make up around three-quarters of society. Nurses, on the other hand, find themselves in the remaining category of those who do productive work. In this instance the iniquity is that people who merely parasitise the productive can find any justification at all, whether it be blame for - however inadvertently - betraying a confidence (the nurse) or acceptance - on whatever grounds - of a morally dubious profession (the disk jockeys), to squeeze the life out of one to whom any of us would surely turn if we ourselves were to be in need.

 

The sheer thoughtlessness of the disk jockeys is staggering almost beyond words. If Prince Charles joked about it then I see that as an attempt to defuse the tension. But someone should have reassured the nurse more directly - and from what little I have heard in news bulletins from the hospital, that is what they said they did: unless their spokesman was blatantly lying, no "reprimand" was involved. Just think about it: three o'clock in the morning and you have the daughter-in-law of the Queen down the corridor and (you think) the Queen herself is on the phone to the ward. Do you automatically think "Hoax" or do you, as a trusting, caring professional respond to the situation on a human level where one mum-in-law's inquiry after their daughter-in-law is as good (or, in everything your training has taught you, ought to be as good) as any other's?

Then ask yourself, if this is good enough for the quarter of the population who actually do the productive work, then why the hell is it not good enough for the spongers and idlers - and, alas, I am forced to include myself in their number - who rely on them to feed them and wipe their backsides when they get fucking ill?

[Ingot54 13]

Hospital attention for morning sickness? Give me a fucking break.

 

MM - as a midwife I can tell you that hospitalisation is the only option for some cases of hyperemesis gravidarum, which while it resembles morning sickness, is a rarer complication. (These days I work more in ICU or Emerg Dept. but keep "my hand in" with occasional obstetrics nursing)

 

Look it up. The viability of the pregnancy is threatened, and the risk to the mother is high. (This is not just a case of the privileged being cotton-wool-coddled because of a bit of vomiting.)

 

Depletion of potassium being the major one, which can lead to cardiac arrest, and/or stroke in an otherwise fit and healthy individual.

 

There are other consequences ... and treatment is usually the replacement of electrolytes and rehydration via intravenous fluids. Some doctors add vitamin B6, but results vary, and there is so far little else that can prevent morning sickness, or treat it, that would not also pose a risk to any developing foetus.

 

Just fyi ... I also take on board your feelings about the ongoing fact of the monarchy - perhaps another thread?

[SunTrader 10]

The interest in the "Royals" or non-royals such as the big-booty Kardashian woman baffles me.

 

Seems this nurse was another victim in this excessive idolatry.

[MightyMouse 12]

MM - as a midwife I can tell you that hospitalisation is the only option for some cases of hyperemesis gravidarum, which while it resembles morning sickness, is a rarer complication. (These days I work more in ICU or Emerg Dept. but keep "my hand in" with occasional obstetrics nursing)

 

Look it up. The viability of the pregnancy is threatened, and the risk to the mother is high. (This is not just a case of the privileged being cotton-wool-coddled because of a bit of vomiting.)

 

Depletion of potassium being the major one, which can lead to cardiac arrest, and/or stroke in an otherwise fit and healthy individual.

 

There are other consequences ... and treatment is usually the replacement of electrolytes and rehydration via intravenous fluids. Some doctors add vitamin B6, but results vary, and there is so far little else that can prevent morning sickness, or treat it, that would not also pose a risk to any developing foetus.

 

Just fyi ... I also take on board your feelings about the ongoing fact of the monarchy - perhaps another thread?

 

Well, then I am the fool and fortunate, I suppose, that my wife's pregnancies were uncomplicated.

 

No need for another thread. I would rather not flatter them by thinking about them further than we already have.

 

I suspect that they are flattered, rather than sickened, by the suicide of the woman.

[casmayhew 10]

I'v had a gut-full of these pompous self important Lords and pommy riff-raff and the dreggs of British tabloid media over this tragic outcome of the Dj prank! Since when do the British public and media hold the high ground? Remember your own very recent phone tap scandal as well as your own hounding of Dianna to death . You put these people of such a high pedestal... Personally I am sick of seeing headline reports about every-time princess kate belches or Willy loses a hair...If the Brits lightened up a bit and didn't take these institutions so seriously...I hold them slightly above Paris Hilton, Lara Bingle and the like...As a public we are force to consume media drivel every time we watch the evening news or pick up a news paper. Personally I don't want my hard earned tax dollars going to waste when Willy decides to drop over to open the Redfurn community center. why should we be forced to pay Millions of dollars in tax so that they tie up are politicians, police and roads each time they consend to pay the outposts a visit? The Royal family have gained their wealth through out history via divide and conquer...They are the world largest drug family after they sent in the British fleet to enforce the opium trade in Chongqing Hongkong there by decimating an entire population to languish in a drug induced morass for decades to retain control....Yeah get off your high horse, the Royals ain't so clean... and are certainly not above reproach or having a laugh at! Good on the DJS for the prank!

[rplust 10]

Exactly. Some chick over reacted and took her life. That's sad, but you cant blame the DJ's for that, or the radio station or anyone else. To top her self over this issue only suggests she had other unresolved issues in her life.

 

Again, sad and unfortunate, but time to move on.

 

"Shit happens" Anon.

 

The "chick" as you say is a 46 year old nurse who has got a family and is the mother of 2 children. So, if she was your wife, I guess you would have told the children.."well kids, the chick is dead, I've to look for a new one. Let's get over it and move on". Consciousness, decency and respect...ever occurred to you...or are those still unresolved issues!?

[SIUYA 11]

dont worry i am playing devils advocate more than anything even though i do side on my side of the discussion. For me the real tragedy becomes one of the blame game, mob mentality and then having nothing constructive come out it........

 

If the two DJ's did nothing wrong, then why would they be more upset than anyone else over this tragedy?

If they did nothing wrong, then there is nothing to worry about ... right?

 

No, we should not be charging me with manslaughter "if one of those DJs becomes so depressed they

then kill themselves."

 

These two actually perpetrated a fraud. They made false representations in order to obtain something that

they were not entitled to. That is, the private property - information - that belonged to someone else, and

which they had no right to. The law says that is fraud, and fraud is a crime.

 

This is an interesting one - is information about a public figure private information, or is it only public when they release it as their own PR. Does the public have a right to know as much information about their future royal leader - i mean the royals work for their subjects right?

Does the hospital have a legal obligation not to reveal information or is it just properly accorded discretion of a patients right to some privacy in a sensitive matter. the information given by a different nurse was hardly sensitive.....

 

"Another nurse then told them: “She’s sleeping at the moment and she has had an uneventful night and sleep is good for her.

 

“She’s been given some fluids to rehydrate her because she was quite dehydrated when she came in but she’s stable at the moment.”

 

The nurse added: “She hasn’t had any retching with me since I’ve been on duty and she has been sleeping on and off. I think it’s difficult sleeping in a strange bed as well.”

 

....................

 

Am I wrong so far? The intention (a prank ... or to to steal further property) is only considered by a court

in determining the severity of the sentence - the fact of the crime remains. A conviction might be recorded

with a probation or no penalty yada yada.

 

My crime is that I have stood back with indignation and outrage, and pointed the finger in anger.

That is because I AM angry. If they didn't make that fraudulent call, that woman lives.

 

The mention of manslaughter may have been over the top in the OP ... yet an unintended death as

a result of a crime can be construed that way by a court.

 

Look - to stand by and say nothing can also be construed as condoning an action. If people do not stand

up when serious issues arise, then these things proceed to a point where lines get crossed and people

seriously get hurt. If you want to take the mickey out of someone, then their innocence needs to be

considered, as well as the consequences.

 

It was very reasonable to foresee that someone might lose their job at that hospital. Is that funny?

Then what follows a dismissal from employment? That is also not funny.

 

yes, but the unintended consequences of people calling for manslaughter charges, or worse means you are still in the same boat - you cant have it both ways.

These guys will likely loose their jobs, and feel responsible for the rest of their lives. That will be pretty bad as it is I am sure. I bet they did not even think it would happen other wise why would they have done it....

They will pay for the consequences and if you then feel that the punishment does not fit the consequences then that is a different matter - you cant call it a crime as yet.

 

The world is full of unintended consequences - get used to it. There needs to consequences for actions but mob rule, emotional responses and outrage to certain offences is not what society needs.

(remember the outrage over certain videos in certain parts of the world that resulted in people dying even though they had nothing to do with the video itself.) Lets not use an incident do show outrage at comedy you dont like.

To voice that you are outraged is fine - to accuse people of crimes, call for manslaughter charges and other such things is not voicing an opinion on your outrage, you are offering a solution without assessing the consequences......how many medical professionals are charged with manslaughter every year v how many errors occur in hospitals. We dont want the blame game (which unfortunately society seems to be heading down) to get out of control and way laid. (Fat people outrage me, but i dont think they should be forced into fat camps)

 

 

Five minutes of fun to result in a possible unemployment ... that was foreseeable.

 

Is this one of those points of reference?

 

I believe now is a good time to draw a line in the sand.

 

DJ's and others in public life need to learn to become a little more creative if they wish to entertain and amuse

with comic relief. Cheap shots really are not funny.

 

Personally I object to my taxes being used by the ABC (Australia) to fund such drivel as "The Chasers."

It is unwatchable and a waste of resources.

 

That sounds like - Personally as I dont have children I think they should not waste tax payers money on such children shows on TV.

 

..... its part of the package - I would prefer such drivel to die a natural death of unpopularity rather than be hounded off the air because of people not liking the humour. There is always the off button, and as for your taxes - i can think of a lot more things that they are wasted on.

 

anyways.....it raises a lot of questions, possibilities and issues that black swan events usually do.

[johnw 10]

I read of the prank on the BBC website and my first thought was "where is the security protocol for both the Hospital and the Royal family"

 

When I read of the sad death of the Nurse (and I might add we all remain unaware of the exact cause of death until an investigation has been completed) I still wondered where the Security Protocols had disappeared to.

 

Certainly, had they been in place, the first part of this event would have ceased to exist ... I am referring to the prank itself and the link between the prank and the Nurse.

 

Personally, I like Aussie humour, it helps define their spirit and it will be a sorry day if it is crushed.

I also prefer a world that includes the British Royal Family and I greatly admire the work of the Queen as I admired the work of her parents during WW2

[MightyMouse 12]

 

 

yes, but the unintended consequences of people calling for manslaughter charges, or worse means you are still in the same boat - you cant have it both ways.

These guys will likely loose their jobs, and feel responsible for the rest of their lives. That will be pretty bad as it is I am sure. I bet they did not even think it would happen other wise why would they have done it....

They will pay for the consequences and if you then feel that the punishment does not fit the consequences then that is a different matter - you cant call it a crime as yet.

 

The world is full of unintended consequences - get used to it. There needs to consequences for actions but mob rule, emotional responses and outrage to certain offences is not what society needs.

(remember the outrage over certain videos in certain parts of the world that resulted in people dying even though they had nothing to do with the video itself.) Lets not use an incident do show outrage at comedy you dont like.

To voice that you are outraged is fine - to accuse people of crimes, call for manslaughter charges and other such things is not voicing an opinion on your outrage, you are offering a solution without assessing the consequences......how many medical professionals are charged with manslaughter every year v how many errors occur in hospitals. We dont want the blame game (which unfortunately society seems to be heading down) to get out of control and way laid. (Fat people outrage me, but i dont think they should be forced into fat camps)

 

 

Everyone might be overlooking the intended consequence of the prank: Laughter.

 

How many people have woken up in Australia feeling suicidal and not committed suicide because they got a laugh out of these DJs? How many wives or children have not been beaten because someone was steered away from angry thoughts and encouraged to laugh by these DJs? God knows it is depressing enough to be in Australia. Let the people laugh.

[Yorkid 10]

God knows it is depressing enough to be in Australia.

 

I agree with that sentiment: when I lived there I found it incomprehensible that people would frequently describe it as "paradise".

 

Would you care to elaborate on what it is about Australia that you find depressing?

[johnw 10]

I agree with that sentiment: when I lived there I found it incomprehensible that people would frequently describe it as "paradise".

 

Would you care to elaborate on what it is about Australia that you find depressing?

 

Why don't you tell us why you think that Auss is depressing ... just to get the ball rolling.

 

Where did you live and how long were you there ... don't worry I am not an Aussie but I have lived there and depressing is not a sentiment thatsprings to mind.

That is why I am curious about your thoughts.

[Yorkid 10]

I didn't want to colour MM's response or steal his thunder, johnw, so in response to your request I've jotted down a few things which I have saved and I promise to post them just as they stand when MM has had time to post something. The last thing I want is to start a daft sort of slanging match about Australia. I'm genuinely interested to hear from someone who has said something that strikes a chord with me.

[SIUYA 11]

given Yorkid is from Scotland my guess might be that the alcohol is not cheap in Oz, or the sunshine burns his skin too much

 

Seriously though I can understand why a lot of people think aspects of Australia are depressing. (and I am an Australian of Scottish heritage )

It is often described as a cultural backwater if you dont think of sport as having any cultural significance.

 

It certainly has issues with thinking its the best and only place in the world to live (maybe there is something in that) and the ignorance associated with that can be a little depressing.

Mind you every country has their own elements and versions of rednecks.

 

the insects certainly suck, and in certain parts of the country you cant venture into the water due to the dangerous creatures (that can be depressing at a beautiful spot with no swimming due to crocodiles signs. The skiing in winter is pathetically poor, the beaches dangerous if you dont learn how to swim or read rips properly.

It has a chronic binge drinking culture that can be depressing (but so does all of the UK)

It is a long way from the rest of the world which is one complaint everyone has - what they fail to realise is that that is also a great thing about it - otherwise the hoards of people there would spoil many good aspects of it.

You might have to travel 6 hours for a good party - but that just shows commitment to the cause.

The people can be completely inappropriate, politically incorrect and insensitive - but i would prefer this to the hidden racism, fear of upsetting groups and hidden hatreds and underlying bigotry in other countries. (see redneck comments above but this is different IMHO)

Its usually too hot in summer and the houses are poorly built for insulation, the bushfires ravage the land followed by floods and other natural disasters that are part of the natural landscape (whats depressing about mother nature at its best)

It produces neighbours and home and away - yes they are depressing and yet for some reason loved in the UK. The politicians like everywhere are corrupt, incompetent and useless, but it has a stable political system that despite some hiccups is pretty good by world standards.

 

Every country has its downsides, often as a result of the upsides.

Personally I love aspects of the place and those who find it depressing are more than free to leave - what more do you want. For those that embrace it, depressing is not very often used.

[MightyMouse 12]

I didn't want to colour MM's response or steal his thunder, johnw, so in response to your request I've jotted down a few things which I have saved and I promise to post them just as they stand when MM has had time to post something. The last thing I want is to start a daft sort of slanging match about Australia. I'm genuinely interested to hear from someone who has said something that strikes a chord with me.

 

My comments were a mock provocation of both Ingot and Siuya who are Aussie Nationals. I have not reason to think that Australia is depressing; frankly, I would suspect just the opposite. Sorry for the confusion.

[Yorkid 10]

Now that MM has had a chance to post, here, as promised is what I wrote before having second thoughts and letting MM have that chance:

A bit about why I find Australia a depressing place to live.

We were in Brisbane and Ipswich. We found an excellent school for the kids - the Brisbane Independent School - and that was by far the best thing about Oz for me.

Where to start with the depressing stuff?

Well, the state school system is repressive. The attitude to the environment is wantonly exploitative to the point of stupidity - and this does not seem to have changed since Donald Horne wrote "The Lucky Country": Tim Flannery is a reference here if you want chapter and verse. The press is parochial and partisan to a cringeworthy degree. The television is appalingly slanted towards the desires of advertisers (note I do not say "needs" of advertisers: what they "need" is to be shown the door). The politicians are as corrupt a bunch of gerrymanderers and pocket-liners as you'll find anywhere. Misogyny is rife. Racism is rife. The cultural datum point seems to be derived from a cross between Edwardian jingoism and an attitude of plebeian false-consciousness - "this is where we get a bit of our own back" (I did say I was reading "The Ragged trousered Philanthropists").

These are just a few of my favourite things :o)

--------------------

Ok, I'd just like to add this: the word "disappointment" is freighted with the unspoken - the expectation that I would find something better in Oz than I left behind in Scotland. My expectations have to be taken into account. I accept that they were probably unrealistic and that I might be accused (by outsiders) of not trying hard enough to appreciate what was on offer. In my defence, I would just like to say that I have better taste than you might imagine and that Australian culture had - we were there from 1990 to 1992 - (and probably still has) to offer :o)

You'll have to believe me that I have no objection to hot weather and that I have seen better parts of the world to live.

You don't, however, need to take my word for it that that glorious Australian export - that shining example of Australian culture, one Rupert Murdoch, is responsible for spreading the noxious virus of tabloid journalism that, despite its few saving graces of investigative success, has given rise to the near global acceptance of the dismally irresponsible attitudes that lead to the sort of incident that gave rise to this thread in the first place.

[SunTrader 10]

Midnight Oil

 

:thumbs up:

[SIUYA 11]

york id - nothing new there - Oz is as disappointing as the next place as most of the same issues occur elsewhere re the environment, politicians and the press (thank god for the internet - a lot has to do with poulation size - another depressing thing is the lack of variety in consumer goods, and dont get me started on our fashion sense - its appallingly bad), and Tim Flannery is a bit of an alarmist. (Mid night oil - i forgot about them they are depressing)

The environment like everywhere on the planet is definately being degraded and in such a fragile land the effects are exacerbated. A lot of that is a direct result of the importation of farming practices from the UK, and perpetuated today. We all wonder WTF Australia is wasting its water on cotton and rice crops for :doh:

 

But you then let the cat out of the bag - Brisbane - or Brisvegas as its locally known in the early 1990s - OMG! - you are lucky you didn;t neck yourself.

You were in redneck heaven with Joh ruling the state finally finished, XXXX being the only drink apart from a bit of Sherry for the girls, and the idea that for locals Queensland was the only place worth living in the world - even my Qland friends shake their heads at some of their fellow men.