Jump to content

Welcome to the new Traders Laboratory! Please bear with us as we finish the migration over the next few days. If you find any issues, want to leave feedback, get in touch with us, or offer suggestions please post to the Support forum here.

  • Welcome Guests

    Welcome. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at Traders Laboratory such as interacting with members, access to all forums, downloading attachments, and eligibility to win free giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE Traders Laboratory account here.

jonbig04

Edge VS Mentality

Recommended Posts

Note: this post is for those few who are really going for high high pareto levels… it is ‘bad advice’ or :offtopic: for everyone else.

 

We have some posters who almost totally favor edge over mentality, some that almost totally favor mentality over edge work and we have some that marginally favor one over the other. As I have previously posted, I find it increasingly necessary to do both concurrently and diligently. I call it ‘up the middle way’, but it can also be seen as ‘consciously re-expanding to contain and balance this polarity’, etc.

 

In my experiences with self and confirmed in working with and helping other traders, it dawned on me that the side (of this ‘argument’) a trader is discounting is the one that needs an increase in priority (but don’t try to just come out and tell that to one of the extremists or know it all’s in here or elsewhere :) ). Balanced emphasis, even when it doesn’t seem related at all, to the mentality side opens one to discovering and implementing edges. And 'obsessing' on the mentality side spawned by the painful consequences of ‘acting out’, etc. indicates a need for more edge work.

 

Basically, beginners at all levels will progress much more rapidly if they spend equal time and energy on the mentality side as they do charts, grail seeking, edge discovery. This includes building a practice of immediately following mentality work with edge work and of immediately following edge work with mentality work…building a habit of immediately following progress in either ‘side’ with serious, value finding (not problem solving) questions about the progress’s implications to the other side. This kind of work is more arduous but it brings geometric returns. Your 'system' is found within you as much as it is objectively.

 

btw, for the target audience of this post - the ‘mentality’ side is not about psychology, new therapeutic modalities, problem solving, conflict resolution, working through fears, etc. If not those, then what is it?

 

Yours, much more humbly than this seems,

 

zdo

 

ps Have a great holiday weekend all

 

pps Yesterday sunilrohira posted this audio link over in the Trading Mind Software thread. It belongs smack up in the middle of this thread

http://club.ino.com/trading/2008/07/...aders-mindset/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Much of what produces success trading has to do with hard work of preparation and attitude (what we call discipline).

 

If you haven't done a good job of researching, and developing a detailed trading plan, then you are "in the weeds"....that is to say, you will not be able to last through the daily stresses of trading as a profession.

 

If you haven't got sufficient "experience" or you haven't got an idea of what to expect when executing your plan, then again you are "in the weeds"...the result is that you are always dealing with uncertainty....and this eventually will beat you down.

 

Most newbies don't have a detailed plan to follow, and because of that, they start to second guess when they lose. In contrast, skilled professionals have a detailed plan...They know what to expect in terms of wins and losses. They also know what kind of experience they will have on a daily basis. Finally they know how to deal psychologically with both success and failure.

 

I hope you will take the time to think about this and apply it to your situation.

 

Good luck

Steve

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Steve, thanks for reply. You are 100% right. I had a system that seemed to work pretty well. [indicators]. But have been trying a simpler system that uses only stochastics. have not grasped it & have no confidence, so do i revert back. A lot of people say get away from indicators, so I decided to try this,Stch crossovers. Support ,Resistance, & double tops bottoms using Inside bars as setup.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sam,

 

Here is something that might or might not help ... ask what the stoch is telling you.

 

A stoch is basically a measure of how close the close is to the most recent X day range (high-low). So for a 6,3,3, stoch then 100% would imply that close was at the top of the 6 days. Its smoothed (3) and smoothed again (3) which give it lag which can actually be helpful also because it removes noise.

 

So, I'd suggest studying the stochs behaviour with this in mind. You might find after a while that you figure out what price move creates the stoch behaviour you are looking for. Even why it works sometimes and not other times.

 

Just a though.

 

Note: not a substitute for a solid un-secondguessable plan but might remove one more fuzzy variable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I do very well paper trading, but after a few losses in real time I am reluctant to trade live. So what am I accomplishing? A great paper trading record? Can't go to the Bank with that.

 

Sam was like this also, when you see your doewn a substancial amount of money, it does something to the brain like it did me. What I did was change my platform to display "pips" instead of currency, and it eased my mind a little bit and it allowed me to ride out the rough points of my positions and not get "spooked" into closing positions before they make their moves.

 

:2c:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I do very well paper trading, but after a few losses in real time I am reluctant to trade live. So what am I accomplishing? A great paper trading record? Can't go to the Bank with that.

 

Sam you are doing better than quite a few. Some people can not execute well in sim mode. To me that indicates that the fears go beyond that of simple financial loss. In your case that does not seem so.

 

Not sure where you trade from or what you trade but if you have access to spread betting or CFD's (contracts for difference) you might want to look at those. They will allow you to trade smaller size than a full contract if you trade indexes take a look at SPY or Q's. Basically rather than going from nothing to a full contract trade pennies and just concentrate on executing flawlessly for say 50 trades. Douglas talks about this exercise in his book. Basically you have to say to yourself even if my stop is hit 50 times i am only gonna loose $100 (or whatever it is) but I will follow through to the end flawlessly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sam,

 

Here are a few ideas to trigger the development of your own ideas for dealing with this.

 

idea 1: If you don’t have edge(s) that you literally LOVE, then demo / screen time / grail search until you do.

 

idea 2: If you do have edge(s) acceptable to you then - All done paper trading! ‘Get real’ and stay that way! With your current edge(s), mindfully, non judgementally face and bring your best game to each new trade. In the future you can demo to develop new skills or forward test new techniques, but with your current edge(s) – stop stroking yourself, stay real, and tough it out.

 

idea 3: If you do have edge(s), but have noted 'mental' issues then for the next x number of weeks, if you are daytrading, then MonWedFri are live days and TueThu are sim/demo/papertrading days. (If you are holding positions overnight then alternate trade 2 real, 1 fake for same basic effect.) Continue this until its obvious you don’t need it anymore, then go 4:1 real:pretend for daytrading days (and 4:1 real to fake positions if position trading) etc to quickly extinguish the papertrading days.

 

idea 4: For a time, restrict your notetaking/journaling to the subjective experiences you have before during and after ‘decision times’ - especially for comparison if you are doing something like idea 3. Even though the fears arise from habits of misrepresentation and misapplied identities, your work is not to destroy, correct, of apply ‘discipline’ or willpower to the ‘losing’. The work is to continue increasing your awareness and perspectives. The behavioral changes in your trading will come on their own!

If you do note/journal on your objective decisions, create a focus on what you are doing that is working far in excess of attention to what you are doing ‘wrong’. For example, if you were applying some version of idea 3 you would pour mental energy onto what’s working on your demo days and quickly acknowledge and forgive your screw ups and losses on live days. Your ‘discipline’ is to focus on how close to excellence you are. Screw trading plan ‘discipline’! If a trader has to apply discipline (in the sense of applying willpower to overcome an impulse or conflict), more than once a month then I question the compatibility of his trading plan with his true nature.

 

idea 5: forward click them freakin amygdala at least once an hour!

 

All the best,

 

zdo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Date: 11th July 2025.   Demand For Gold Rises As Trump Announces Tariffs!   Gold prices rose significantly throughout the week as investors took advantage of the 2.50% lower entry level. Investors also return to the safe-haven asset as the US trade policy continues to escalate. As a result, investors are taking a more dovish tone. The ‘risk-off’ appetite is also something which can be seen within the stock market. The NASDAQ on Thursday took a 0.90% dive within only 30 minutes.   Trade Tensions Escalate President Trump has been teasing with new tariffs throughout the week. However, the tariffs were confirmed on Thursday. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports starting August 1st, along with 50% tariffs on copper and goods from Brazil. Some experts are advising that Brazil has been specifically targeted due to its association with the BRICS.   However, the President has not directly associated the tariffs with BRICS yet. According to President Trump, Brazil is targeting US technology companies and carrying out a ‘witch hunt’against former Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, a close ally who is currently facing prosecution for allegedly attempting to overturn the 2022 Brazilian election.   Although Brazil is one of the largest and fastest-growing economies in the Americas, it is not the main concern for investors. Investors are more concerned about Tariffs on Canada. The White House said it will impose a 35% tariff on Canadian imports, effective August 1st, raised from the earlier 25% rate. This covers most goods, with exceptions under USMCA and exemptions for Canadian companies producing within the US.   It is also vital for investors to note that Canada is among the US;’s top 3 trading partners. The increase was justified by Trump citing issues like the trade deficit, Canada’s handling of fentanyl trafficking, and perceived unfair trade practices.   The President is also threatening new measures against the EU. These moves caused US and European stock futures to fall nearly 1%, while the Dollar rose and commodity prices saw small gains. However, the main benefactor was Silver and Gold, which are the two best-performing metals of the day.   How Will The Fed Impact Gold? The FOMC indicated that the number of members warming up to the idea of interest rate cuts is increasing. If the Fed takes a dovish tone, the price of Gold may further rise. In the meantime, the President pushing for a 3% rate cut sparked talk of a more dovish Fed nominee next year and raised worries about future inflation.   Meanwhile, jobless claims dropped for the fourth straight week, coming in better than expected and supporting the view that the labour market remains strong after last week’s solid payroll report. Markets still expect two rate cuts this year, but rate futures show most investors see no change at the next Fed meeting. Gold is expected to finish the week mostly flat.       Gold 15-Minute Chart     If the price of Gold increases above $3,337.50, buy signals are likely to materialise again. However, the price is currently retracing, meaning traders are likely to wait for regained momentum before entering further buy trades. According to HSBC, they expect an average price of $3,215 in 2025 (up from $3,015) and $3,125 in 2026, with projections showing a volatile range between $3,100 and $3,600   Key Takeaway Points: Gold Rises on Safe-Haven Demand. Gold gained as investors reacted to rising trade tensions and market volatility. Canada Tariffs Spark Concern. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports drew attention due to Canada’s key trade role. Fed Dovish Shift Supports Gold. Growing expectations of rate cuts and Trump’s push for a 3% cut boosted the gold outlook. Gold Eyes Breakout Above $3,337.5. Price is consolidating; a move above $3,337.50 could trigger new buy signals. Always trade with strict risk management. Your capital is the single most important aspect of your trading business.   Please note that times displayed based on local time zone and are from time of writing this report.   Click HERE to access the full HFM Economic calendar.   Want to learn to trade and analyse the markets? Join our webinars and get analysis and trading ideas combined with better understanding of how markets work. Click HERE to register for FREE!   Click HERE to READ more Market news.   Michalis Efthymiou HFMarkets   Disclaimer: This material is provided as a general marketing communication for information purposes only and does not constitute an independent investment research. Nothing in this communication contains, or should be considered as containing, an investment advice or an investment recommendation or a solicitation for the purpose of buying or selling of any financial instrument. All information provided is gathered from reputable sources and any information containing an indication of past performance is not a guarantee or reliable indicator of future performance. Users acknowledge that any investment in Leveraged Products is characterized by a certain degree of uncertainty and that any investment of this nature involves a high level of risk for which the users are solely responsible and liable. We assume no liability for any loss arising from any investment made based on the information provided in this communication. This communication must not be reproduced or further distributed without our prior written permission.
    • Back in the early 2000s, Netflix mailed DVDs to subscribers.   It wasn’t sexy—but it was smart. No late fees. No driving to Blockbuster.   People subscribed because they were lazy. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone else is lazy too.   Those who saw the future in that red envelope? They could’ve caught a 10,000%+ move.   Another story…   Back in the mid-2000s, Amazon launched Prime.   It wasn’t flashy—but it was fast.   Free two-day shipping. No minimums. No hassle.   People subscribed because they were impatient. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone hates waiting.   Those who saw the future in that speedy little yellow button? They could’ve caught another 10,000%+ move.   Finally…   Back in 2011, Bitcoin was trading under $10.   It wasn’t regulated—but it worked.   No bank. No middleman. Just wallet to wallet.   People used it to send money. Investors bought it because they saw the potential.   Those who saw something glimmering in that strange orange coin? They could’ve caught a 100,000%+ move.   The people who made those calls weren’t fortune tellers. They just noticed something simple before others did.   A better way. A quiet shift. A small edge. An asymmetric bet.   The red envelope fixed late fees. The yellow button fixed waiting. The orange coin gave billions a choice.   Of course, these types of gains are rare. And they happen only once in a blue moon. That’s exactly why it’s important to notice when the conditions start to look familiar.   Not after the move. Not once it's on CNBC. But in the quiet build-up— before the surface breaks.   Enter the Blue Button Please read more here: https://altucherconfidential.com/posts/netflix-amazon-bitcoin-blue  Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/ 
    • What These Attacks Look Like There are several ways you could get hacked. And the threats compound by the day.   Here’s a quick rundown:   Phishing: Fake emails from your “bank.” Click the link, give your password—game over.   Ransomware: Malware that locks your files and demands crypto. Pay up, or it’s gone.   DDoS: Overwhelm a website with traffic until it crashes. Like 10,000 bots blocking the door. Often used by nations.   Man-in-the-Middle: Hackers intercept your messages on public WiFi and read or change them.   Social Engineering: Hackers pose as IT or drop infected USB drives labeled “Payroll.”   You don’t need to be “important” to be a target.   You just need to be online.   What You Can Do (Without Buying a Bunker) You don’t have to be tech-savvy.   You just need to stop being low-hanging fruit.   Here’s how:   Use a YubiKey (physical passkey device) or Authenticator app – Ditch text message 2FA. SIM swaps are real. Hackers often have people on the inside at telecom companies.   Use a password manager (with Yubikey) – One unique password per account. Stop using your dog’s name.   Update your devices – Those annoying updates patch real security holes. Use them.   Back up your files – If ransomware hits, you don’t want your important documents held hostage.   Avoid public WiFi for sensitive stuff – Or use a VPN.   Think before you click – Emails that feel “urgent” are often fake. Go to the websites manually for confirmation.   Consider Starlink in case the internet goes down – I think it’s time for me to make the leap. Don’t Panic. Prepare. (Then Invest.)   I spent an hour in that basement bar reading about cyberattacks—and watching real-world systems fall apart like dominos.   The internet going down used to be an inconvenience. Now, it’s a warning.   Cyberwar isn’t coming. It’s here.   And the next time your internet goes out, it might not just be your router.   Don’t panic. Prepare.   And maybe keep a backup plan in your back pocket. Like a local basement bar with good bourbon—and working WiFi.   As usual, we’re on the lookout for more opportunities in cybersecurity. Stay tuned.   Author: Chris Campbell (AltucherConfidential) Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/   
    • DUMBSHELL:  re the automation of corruption ---  200,000 "Science Papers" in academic journal database PubMed may have been AI-generated with errors, hallucinations and false sourcing 
    • Does any crypto exchanges get banned in your country? How's about other as Bybit, Kraken, MEXC, OKX?
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.