[romanus]

Originally Posted by PointOne »

Could you annotate the P2 (of the blue or black channel) and the associated FTT (on the next faster fractal) on your chart, I still can't see it.

Blue trendlines represent a 5 min ES level Traverse with Point Three at 14:20. Olive and black trendlines represent tapes (which have tapes inside it). The blue Point Two at 10:45 is derived from looking at Price only. If 10:45 was also the end of medium level B2B, then the entire 10:45 to 13:25 lateral would have been \R of medium thickness which would cause 13:30 to be the completion and the end of the 5 min ES level sequence. That in turn would mean that a new sequence would begin from that point forward for a down 5 min ES level Traverse. As you can see it didn't happen. Which means something prevents 10:45 from being the end of medium level B2B. That something is the lack of FTT at that point. 10:45 is a VE of the olive tape and 13:30 is an FTT of the black tape, with black tape derived from olive by fanning.

Again, the above is based on defining the 'TAPE' and 'TRAVERSE' on both trendlines and gaussians, and not just by looking at price alone.

Originally Posted by PointOne »

(From your post above it seems that your P2 is not where the LTL is drawn.)

You are absolutely correct. P2 is where gaussians say it is.

[PointOne]

Originally Posted by romanus »

You are absolutely correct. P2 is where gaussians say it is.

So how do you decide where to place your LTL if it is not through P2?

[romanus]

Originally Posted by PointOne »

So how do you decide where to place your LTL if it is not through P2?

The LTL is still where the price says it is, however the gaussians determine when all sequences reached their completion and where the current trend ends and new begins on the same fractal.

[romanus]

Originally Posted by ljyoung »

The 'P2' to which you are referring is not a P2 of a 5 min ES traverse as you can verify for yourself by annotating the channels from the prior day. I believe I am correct in saying that when romanus refers to a 'traverse' he is referring to a 5 min ES traverse, what Neoxx has called a 'standard traverse'. Anything faster is a tape or a fat tape or a fasterfractal traverse or a subfractal traverse or a goat or whatever.

I know exactly what you are referring to with the "VE" (and "LTL") bounces and BO's but what is being said here, and I believe correctly, is that such bounces and BO's, while tradable, are not bounces and BO's of 5 min ES traverses.

lj

Here's another one, in case you were ever wondering (like me ) what the hell was built that day.

[PointOne]

Originally Posted by romanus »

The LTL is still where the price says it is, however the gaussians determine when all sequences reached their completion and where the current trend ends and new begins on the same fractal.

"Learn to understand what your Gaussians are telling you. By doing so, you'll automatically understand which fractal provided the signal you see, and more importantly, whether or not that particular fractal has completed its sequences."

So we agree where P2 is located. Good. It's on a VE.

Your tenet states that there is an FTT of something at every point 1, 2 and 3. I dispute that there is always an FTT at P2s. Your example shows a P2 on a VE. A VE cannot be an FTT, by definition.

Your tenet, if true, applies on all fractals. But your fanned black traverse has its P2 on the VE of the faster tapes. Where is the FTT of the tape forming the black traverse P2?

[romanus]

Originally Posted by PointOne »

...
Your tenet states that there is an FTT of something at every point 1, 2 and 3. I dispute that there is always an FTT at P2s. Your example shows a P2 on a VE. A VE cannot be an FTT, by definition.

The example shows point 2 of the tape on the VE of the tape. (Black trendlines do not represent a 5 min ES level traverse).

Originally Posted by PointOne »

...
Your tenet, if true, applies on all fractals. But your fanned black traverse has its P2 on the VE of the faster tapes. Where is the FTT of the tape forming the black traverse P2?

Black trendlines do not represent a 5 min ES level traverse. They represent a tape. A tape which ends with an FTT at 13:30.

Originally Posted by PointOne »

...
Your tenet, if true, applies on all fractals.

Yes it does. Tapes, however, being the smallest unit in terms of fractals may represent a challenge as their point 2 must be an FTT of something finer than a tape, which is not always identifiable on a 5 min chart. Luckily, in our example, dashed teal trendlines exist. See attached.

[Neoxx]

I, for one, would be very disappointed if this thread became embroiled in debate, discussion and verbal sparring, for which the other contemporary thread may serve a better arena.

We're grateful to have Spyder back, as what may be a 'last gasp' effort to bring everyone up to speed, and, at least in my opinion, the onus should be on promoting maximum utility.

I sincerely hope this thread does not become derailed, teeter on the brink, and plummet into the precipice.

[Ezzy]

Originally Posted by Spydertrader »

Neoxx used the phrase "in this example" in his question. You didn't notice the highlighted orange section within the portion of his post I quoted? Since Neoxx chose to discuss this example instead of all examples, he has provided boundaries for his question.

Your post applied my answer (to his question) outside those boundaries. In other words, my answer does not apply to all examples - only this one.

You arrived at a specific conclusion. That being, the attachments you posted represent "legitimate alternatives" to what I have stated. I encourage everyone to compare these "legitimate alternatives" against known areas of the market where one knows what the market has provided. In other words, one needs to compare and contrast the "legitimate alternatives" against an area of the market where the same thing occurs and determine if the conclusion of "legitimate alternatives" represents a valid viewpoint or wishful thinking.

- Spydertrader

Was applying it outside the "boundaries" a reference to the question being only about it being a traverse?

Was your answer to Neoxx with or without the gaussians already drawn in, as in that specific example?

I walked through the alternatives. Any comments or other things that should have been taken into consideration?

Thanks - EZ
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