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Old 09-02-2011, 11:06 AM   #17

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Re: Market Manipulation

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After this momentuous victory against the "robots", the only event that could possibly top it, would be extrication (by force or otherwise) of the Chairsatan and his globalistic central planning cohort from capital markets
who is chairsatan?
........
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Old 09-02-2011, 10:06 PM   #18

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Re: Market Manipulation

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Originally Posted by zdo »
HFT.
Goodbye High Frequency Trading - Regulators Seek Secret HFT Codes | ZeroHedge

“…the end for HFT”
Is ‘Tyler’ right?
No and the article even mentions that the current action is very esoteric in nature. For ZH to imply that the current action is the beginning of the end for HFTs is ridiculous. More importantly, why should HFTs be banned? There's no credible evidence that they caused the flash crash. If they have a legit arb opportunity, what is the basis upon which they can't make a trade? If lines start getting drawn as to certain trading styles being okay and others not, we've got a bigger problem than anything HFTs are supposedly perpetrating.
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Old 09-03-2011, 05:03 AM   #19

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Re: Market Manipulation

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Originally Posted by jackb »
No and the article even mentions that the current action is very esoteric in nature. For ZH to imply that the current action is the beginning of the end for HFTs is ridiculous. More importantly, why should HFTs be banned? There's no credible evidence that they caused the flash crash. If they have a legit arb opportunity, what is the basis upon which they can't make a trade? If lines start getting drawn as to certain trading styles being okay and others not, we've got a bigger problem than anything HFTs are supposedly perpetrating.
The HFT's are getting information before everyone else can get it. The exchanges are knowingly giving the information to HFT earlier than everyone else is getting it.The exchanges understand how important early information is because they make certain that the hft's get the data at the same time as each other. They do thinks like make sure that the data cable that reaches you is the same length as the cable that reaches me if we are both HFTs who pay for the advantage to make sure that neither you nor I have an advantage over the other.

The trading style they use is front running and front running is illegal.
normally, front running is done inside a brokerage firm. This time it is happening to the brokerage fim before it enters the brokerage firm.
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Old 09-03-2011, 11:05 AM   #20

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Re: Market Manipulation

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The HFT's are getting information before everyone else can get it. The exchanges are knowingly giving the information to HFT earlier than everyone else is getting it.
yeah? who told you that? I have my own HFT connected to CME. I would love to get an evidence and sue millions out of CME. and never trade again.. please help me to change my life I will cut you in for 20%
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Old 09-03-2011, 12:21 PM   #21

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Re: Market Manipulation

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yeah? who told you that? I have my own HFT connected to CME. I would love to get an evidence and sue millions out of CME. and never trade again.. please help me to change my life I will cut you in for 20%
eveidence?

They pay the exchanges big money. its old news.
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Old 09-03-2011, 01:27 PM   #22

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Re: Market Manipulation

no evidence no cut Mouse.
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Old 09-05-2011, 03:48 AM   #23

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Re: Market Manipulation

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Originally Posted by MightyMouse »
The HFT's are getting information before everyone else can get it. The exchanges are knowingly giving the information to HFT earlier than everyone else is getting it.The exchanges understand how important early information is because they make certain that the hft's get the data at the same time as each other. They do thinks like make sure that the data cable that reaches you is the same length as the cable that reaches me if we are both HFTs who pay for the advantage to make sure that neither you nor I have an advantage over the other.

The trading style they use is front running and front running is illegal.
normally, front running is done inside a brokerage firm. This time it is happening to the brokerage fim before it enters the brokerage firm.
Front running is applicable to those that are placing orders for others and using that info to step in front and make proprietary, risk-free trades. There's no evidence that any of the HFTs are involved in such activity. In fact, most of the studies show they are strictly going after arbitrage opportunities.

Seeing a print on the tape before someone else does not constitute front running. Of course, the issue of who gets to see the print fastest is a long-standing issue. From the linking of people yelling stock quotes from window to window, to chalkboards to the ticker tape to now, there's always been someone who, by definition, is first in line. This issue was in play when you (all of us) began trading. Now that it's being fought on the picosecond scale is of no bigger consequence.
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Old 09-05-2011, 09:30 AM   #24

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Re: Market Manipulation

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Originally Posted by jackb »
Front running is applicable to those that are placing orders for others and using that info to step in front and make proprietary, risk-free trades. There's no evidence that any of the HFTs are involved in such activity. In fact, most of the studies show they are strictly going after arbitrage opportunities.

Seeing a print on the tape before someone else does not constitute front running. Of course, the issue of who gets to see the print fastest is a long-standing issue. From the linking of people yelling stock quotes from window to window, to chalkboards to the ticker tape to now, there's always been someone who, by definition, is first in line. This issue was in play when you (all of us) began trading. Now that it's being fought on the picosecond scale is of no bigger consequence.
Most of the time, those who are first in line are breaking laws. we simply are used to it. A lot of the HFT's may in fact not be breaking laws, if they are not in a position of knowing costumer orders. A firm such as GS or JPM, who deal with investors, should in no way be engaged in HFT activity and yet they are. I would not be content if my broker who had information of my position was actively trading against it.

My commentary is directed toward the exchanges who, for pay. give preferential information to certain parties. It makes for an unfair playing field.
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