Jump to content

Welcome to the new Traders Laboratory! Please bear with us as we finish the migration over the next few days. If you find any issues, want to leave feedback, get in touch with us, or offer suggestions please post to the Support forum here.

  • Welcome Guests

    Welcome. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at Traders Laboratory such as interacting with members, access to all forums, downloading attachments, and eligibility to win free giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE Traders Laboratory account here.

Brolizzz

Scam or Fraud or Stupid Me?

Recommended Posts

Hello guys this is my first thread in TL. So i had this incident yesterday and i as newbie saw profits and wanted to cash in but it went like this

 

 

At 19:24:49 yesterday (10th December) you sold £2/pt of Daily Brent Crude (Jan) to open at 10723 with no stops or limits. The last rollover time is 19:15 and the market expires at 19.30. Settlement is basis the official closing price of the relevant ICE Brent Crude Oil future. After expiry the initial position is closed and a new position is opened at the closing price +/- 1pt (2 pts for Controlled Risk). Adjustment will occur when the underlying future changes, as was the case last night (10th December) when the front month future was changed from January to February.

 

Your account is setup for all daily future bets to rollover at expiry. Therefore at 19:30:29 when you attempted to close the position online you were unable to do so as the market was in the process of rolling over to the next day. At this point we were also changing the front month from January to February. It is possible that whilst the front month was being changed for a split second online the profit on the position may have being valuing basis the price of the February contract as opposed to the January contract.

 

You called the desk at 20:09:52. At the beginning of the call you ask the dealer to close the contract basis the price you see which displays profit in the region of £190.

 

The dealer then goes away to check the price and returns to inform you that the price you are seeing is invalid and that the position is in the process of rolling and the front month is being changed. He explains that when the front month contract is changed, when a daily position rolls the spread you pay remains the same but the difference in the absolute levels will change due to the difference between the fair value of the respective contracts. He explains that this is what has happened in this instance. Towards the end of the conversation you state you are now able to deal on the contract online. Your request to close the position at the beginning of the call was under the premise that it be done at the level which would realise you in the region of £190 profit, which the dealer informs you is not possible, hence nothing was done. The call ends at 20:16:18 and you then buy back £2/pt to close the position online at 10623 in the February contract at 20:17:25, moments after the call ends.

 

 

To conclude, the evolution of the bet was as follows:

 

10 Dec 19:24:24:49 GMT you sell £2/pt to open of the Daily Brent Crude (Jan) contract at 10723.

 

10 Dec 19:30:29 GMT you attempt to buy back £2/pt to close at 10748 but the order is rejected as the market is offline due to it being rolled and the front month being changed from January to February.(how do they know what i was wanted to do?

 

10 Dec 20:11:50 GMT the position rolls. Your position is closed out at 10733 on the January contract, realising a loss of £20, and simultaneously reopened on the February contract, short £2/pt at 10620.

 

10 Dec 20:17:25 GMT you close this position online, buying £2/pt to close at 10623, realising a loss of £6.

 

 

So after all this should i be the beneficial of this changes and market move? To me it seems like i was duped feels like whey was roll overing my position instead taking 2-pts they took 100-pts and was ripped. Please clear my confusion with one guys if u know what happened.

 

Thank You

A.Z

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hello guys this is my first thread in TL. So i had this incident yesterday and i as newbie saw profits and wanted to cash in but it went like this

 

 

At 19:24:49 yesterday (10th December) you sold £2/pt of Daily Brent Crude (Jan) to open at 10723 with no stops or limits. The last rollover time is 19:15 and the market expires at 19.30. Settlement is basis the official closing price of the relevant ICE Brent Crude Oil future. After expiry the initial position is closed and a new position is opened at the closing price +/- 1pt (2 pts for Controlled Risk). Adjustment will occur when the underlying future changes, as was the case last night (10th December) when the front month future was changed from January to February.

 

Your account is setup for all daily future bets to rollover at expiry. Therefore at 19:30:29 when you attempted to close the position online you were unable to do so as the market was in the process of rolling over to the next day. At this point we were also changing the front month from January to February. It is possible that whilst the front month was being changed for a split second online the profit on the position may have being valuing basis the price of the February contract as opposed to the January contract.

 

You called the desk at 20:09:52. At the beginning of the call you ask the dealer to close the contract basis the price you see which displays profit in the region of £190.

 

The dealer then goes away to check the price and returns to inform you that the price you are seeing is invalid and that the position is in the process of rolling and the front month is being changed. He explains that when the front month contract is changed, when a daily position rolls the spread you pay remains the same but the difference in the absolute levels will change due to the difference between the fair value of the respective contracts. He explains that this is what has happened in this instance. Towards the end of the conversation you state you are now able to deal on the contract online. Your request to close the position at the beginning of the call was under the premise that it be done at the level which would realise you in the region of £190 profit, which the dealer informs you is not possible, hence nothing was done. The call ends at 20:16:18 and you then buy back £2/pt to close the position online at 10623 in the February contract at 20:17:25, moments after the call ends.

 

 

To conclude, the evolution of the bet was as follows:

 

10 Dec 19:24:24:49 GMT you sell £2/pt to open of the Daily Brent Crude (Jan) contract at 10723.

 

10 Dec 19:30:29 GMT you attempt to buy back £2/pt to close at 10748 but the order is rejected as the market is offline due to it being rolled and the front month being changed from January to February.(how do they know what i was wanted to do?

 

10 Dec 20:11:50 GMT the position rolls. Your position is closed out at 10733 on the January contract, realising a loss of £20, and simultaneously reopened on the February contract, short £2/pt at 10620.

 

10 Dec 20:17:25 GMT you close this position online, buying £2/pt to close at 10623, realising a loss of £6.

 

 

So after all this should i be the beneficial of this changes and market move? To me it seems like i was duped feels like whey was roll overing my position instead taking 2-pts they took 100-pts and was ripped. Please clear my confusion with one guys if u know what happened.

 

Thank You

A.Z

 

Perhaps you should consider trading in the underlying futures market rather than using spreadbetting - the tax relief might appeal, but in the long run the spread and "execution irregularities" will kill you. If you traded futures and made money then you could get a tax expert to investigate ways of protecting your profits.

 

BlueHorseshoe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Brollo

"You was robbed"

But I think the moral of the story is , unless you work on a particular market , you cant wait till the last minute to close a deal. Especialy if its an unregulated market like Spreads.

And just to raise a few eyebrows, spread betting is gambling.

Whats wrong with buying a nice big bank like Goldman and just follow the trend. ?

regards

bobc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To conclude, the evolution of the bet was as follows:

 

10 Dec 19:24:24:49 GMT you sell £2/pt to open of the Daily Brent Crude (Jan) contract at 10723.

 

10 Dec 19:30:29 GMT you attempt to buy back £2/pt to close at 10748 but the order is rejected as the market is offline due to it being rolled and the front month being changed from January to February.(how do they know what i was wanted to do?

 

If you are short, and the roll is automatic, then you will be short the next month. If you dont roll yourself or close out then thats all they can do - this makes perfect sense for all involved. You keep the same exposure.

 

 

10 Dec 20:11:50 GMT the position rolls. Your position is closed out at 10733 on the January contract, realising a loss of £20, and simultaneously reopened on the February contract, short £2/pt at 10620.

 

10 Dec 20:17:25 GMT you close this position online, buying £2/pt to close at 10623, realising a loss of £6.

 

 

So after all this should i be the beneficial of this changes and market move? To me it seems like i was duped feels like whey was roll overing my position instead taking 2-pts they took 100-pts and was ripped. Please clear my confusion with one guys if u know what happened.

 

Thank You

A.Z

 

Look up Contango and backwardation.

You need to understand this - there was no market move (at least to the extent you think)

Plus if you do the math (s) you say 'they' took 100 points and yet you only lost 13 points.

 

I suggest you understand the rolling process and that way you wont think either you are stupid, OR that they ripped you off.

 

Basically it looks like

Jan contract you sold 10723 and AS PART OF THE ROLL bought back to close at 10733

Feb contract AS PART OF THE ROLL you sold to open at 10620 then closed out at 1623

 

your account reflect this. period. The only thing you might want to look at is the change in the spread between Jan and Feb over the last few days. Otherwise it looks nothing strange here, except that you thought you could close out or roll at a time the market was effectively closed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi Brollo

"You was robbed"

But I think the moral of the story is , unless you work on a particular market , you cant wait till the last minute to close a deal. Especialy if its an unregulated market like Spreads.

And just to raise a few eyebrows, spread betting is gambling.

Whats wrong with buying a nice big bank like Goldman and just follow the trend. ?

regards

bobc

 

All derivatives trading is gambling. Spread-betting differs only in the details, in exactly the same way as the details differ between options and futures, cmos and cdos, bonds and swaps, etc etc.

 

With all of the above, it's crucial to understand the details and how they impact upon your chances of success. Sometimes the impact can be minimized. For instance, which would you prefer - 60k profit in futures, or 40k profit in a spreadbetting account? Unless you know a good tax lawyer, it's a no-brainer. So the only question is, can you make 40k as easily spread-betting as you can make 60k trading futures? To answer that you need to know the details of how each one operates.

 

BlueHorseshoe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank You guys for clearing this one for me out.

 

Yes this is a gamble for some for others a job, career etc. We all know the good and the bad bit of it :)

 

Blackhorseshoe i do understand that i should try underlying futures market.

What i was focusing more is the flow off some certain markets like Daily brent or EUR/USD.

To get to know charts and scalp when i see a chance to make some profit..

For me Futures market still unknown.

I'm kinda very uncomfortable to make predictions on my own reasoning but it could be my demise if i wont try more frequent.

 

Is binary options worth a go? Or stick with original Futures better?

 

Again Thanks for reply guys really appreciate.

 

 

Brolizzz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thank You guys for clearing this one for me out.

 

Yes this is a gamble for some for others a job, career etc. We all know the good and the bad bit of it :)

 

Blackhorseshoe i do understand that i should try underlying futures market.

What i was focusing more is the flow off some certain markets like Daily brent or EUR/USD.

To get to know charts and scalp when i see a chance to make some profit..

For me Futures market still unknown.

I'm kinda very uncomfortable to make predictions on my own reasoning but it could be my demise if i wont try more frequent.

 

Is binary options worth a go? Or stick with original Futures better?

 

Again Thanks for reply guys really appreciate.

 

 

Brolizzz

 

Hi Brolizzz,

 

I'm afraid I'm not qualified to offer you any specific trading advice or tell you which derivatives you should be trading. My recommendation (to you and all other traders) is simply that you ensure that you are fully cognizant of how the execuition foibles of a particular derivative impact upon your strategy's perfomance. You should be able to put a pretty certain figure to this, not a broad estimate.

 

For an example of what failure to fill limit orders can do to a strategy, take a quick look at the perfomance reports in post #50 here: http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/day-trading-scalping/13811-daytraders-do-you-know-your-enemy-7.html

 

Hope that's helpful,

 

BlueHorseshoe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hello guys this is my first thread in TL. So i had this incident yesterday and i as newbie saw profits and wanted to cash in but it went like this

 

 

At 19:24:49 yesterday (10th December) you sold £2/pt of Daily Brent Crude (Jan) to open at 10723 with no stops or limits. The last rollover time is 19:15 and the market expires at 19.30. Settlement is basis the official closing price of the relevant ICE Brent Crude Oil future. After expiry the initial position is closed and a new position is opened at the closing price +/- 1pt (2 pts for Controlled Risk). Adjustment will occur when the underlying future changes, as was the case last night (10th December) when the front month future was changed from January to February.

 

Your account is setup for all daily future bets to rollover at expiry. Therefore at 19:30:29 when you attempted to close the position online you were unable to do so as the market was in the process of rolling over to the next day. At this point we were also changing the front month from January to February. It is possible that whilst the front month was being changed for a split second online the profit on the position may have being valuing basis the price of the February contract as opposed to the January contract.

 

You called the desk at 20:09:52. At the beginning of the call you ask the dealer to close the contract basis the price you see which displays profit in the region of £190.

 

The dealer then goes away to check the price and returns to inform you that the price you are seeing is invalid and that the position is in the process of rolling and the front month is being changed. He explains that when the front month contract is changed, when a daily position rolls the spread you pay remains the same but the difference in the absolute levels will change due to the difference between the fair value of the respective contracts. He explains that this is what has happened in this instance. Towards the end of the conversation you state you are now able to deal on the contract online. Your request to close the position at the beginning of the call was under the premise that it be done at the level which would realise you in the region of £190 profit, which the dealer informs you is not possible, hence nothing was done. The call ends at 20:16:18 and you then buy back £2/pt to close the position online at 10623 in the February contract at 20:17:25, moments after the call ends.

 

 

To conclude, the evolution of the bet was as follows:

 

10 Dec 19:24:24:49 GMT you sell £2/pt to open of the Daily Brent Crude (Jan) contract at 10723.

 

10 Dec 19:30:29 GMT you attempt to buy back £2/pt to close at 10748 but the order is rejected as the market is offline due to it being rolled and the front month being changed from January to February.(how do they know what i was wanted to do?

 

10 Dec 20:11:50 GMT the position rolls. Your position is closed out at 10733 on the January contract, realising a loss of £20, and simultaneously reopened on the February contract, short £2/pt at 10620.

 

10 Dec 20:17:25 GMT you close this position online, buying £2/pt to close at 10623, realising a loss of £6.

 

 

So after all this should i be the beneficial of this changes and market move? To me it seems like i was duped feels like whey was roll overing my position instead taking 2-pts they took 100-pts and was ripped. Please clear my confusion with one guys if u know what happened.

 

Thank You

A.Z

you might want to locate mitsubishi. he is the professional spread betting gambler of the lot here. i am quite sure he can tell you exactly what happened and what you need to look at doing in the future. he might be hard to find as he disappears sometimes but he'll be back....just keep looking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
All derivatives trading is gambling. Spread-betting differs only in the details, in exactly the same way as the details differ between options and futures, cmos and cdos, bonds and swaps, etc etc.

 

With all of the above, it's crucial to understand the details and how they impact upon your chances of success. Sometimes the impact can be minimized. For instance, which would you prefer - 60k profit in futures, or 40k profit in a spreadbetting account? Unless you know a good tax lawyer, it's a no-brainer. So the only question is, can you make 40k as easily spread-betting as you can make 60k trading futures? To answer that you need to know the details of how each one operates.

 

BlueHorseshoe

 

It is a long debate though but I dun think "all" derivatives trading falls under the category of gambling. Bottom line to this can be, in my opinion, why govt or economists or specialists in this field do not consider those as gambling? There will be minor differences which is why spread betting income is treated in a different way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Date: 11th July 2025.   Demand For Gold Rises As Trump Announces Tariffs!   Gold prices rose significantly throughout the week as investors took advantage of the 2.50% lower entry level. Investors also return to the safe-haven asset as the US trade policy continues to escalate. As a result, investors are taking a more dovish tone. The ‘risk-off’ appetite is also something which can be seen within the stock market. The NASDAQ on Thursday took a 0.90% dive within only 30 minutes.   Trade Tensions Escalate President Trump has been teasing with new tariffs throughout the week. However, the tariffs were confirmed on Thursday. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports starting August 1st, along with 50% tariffs on copper and goods from Brazil. Some experts are advising that Brazil has been specifically targeted due to its association with the BRICS.   However, the President has not directly associated the tariffs with BRICS yet. According to President Trump, Brazil is targeting US technology companies and carrying out a ‘witch hunt’against former Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, a close ally who is currently facing prosecution for allegedly attempting to overturn the 2022 Brazilian election.   Although Brazil is one of the largest and fastest-growing economies in the Americas, it is not the main concern for investors. Investors are more concerned about Tariffs on Canada. The White House said it will impose a 35% tariff on Canadian imports, effective August 1st, raised from the earlier 25% rate. This covers most goods, with exceptions under USMCA and exemptions for Canadian companies producing within the US.   It is also vital for investors to note that Canada is among the US;’s top 3 trading partners. The increase was justified by Trump citing issues like the trade deficit, Canada’s handling of fentanyl trafficking, and perceived unfair trade practices.   The President is also threatening new measures against the EU. These moves caused US and European stock futures to fall nearly 1%, while the Dollar rose and commodity prices saw small gains. However, the main benefactor was Silver and Gold, which are the two best-performing metals of the day.   How Will The Fed Impact Gold? The FOMC indicated that the number of members warming up to the idea of interest rate cuts is increasing. If the Fed takes a dovish tone, the price of Gold may further rise. In the meantime, the President pushing for a 3% rate cut sparked talk of a more dovish Fed nominee next year and raised worries about future inflation.   Meanwhile, jobless claims dropped for the fourth straight week, coming in better than expected and supporting the view that the labour market remains strong after last week’s solid payroll report. Markets still expect two rate cuts this year, but rate futures show most investors see no change at the next Fed meeting. Gold is expected to finish the week mostly flat.       Gold 15-Minute Chart     If the price of Gold increases above $3,337.50, buy signals are likely to materialise again. However, the price is currently retracing, meaning traders are likely to wait for regained momentum before entering further buy trades. According to HSBC, they expect an average price of $3,215 in 2025 (up from $3,015) and $3,125 in 2026, with projections showing a volatile range between $3,100 and $3,600   Key Takeaway Points: Gold Rises on Safe-Haven Demand. Gold gained as investors reacted to rising trade tensions and market volatility. Canada Tariffs Spark Concern. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports drew attention due to Canada’s key trade role. Fed Dovish Shift Supports Gold. Growing expectations of rate cuts and Trump’s push for a 3% cut boosted the gold outlook. Gold Eyes Breakout Above $3,337.5. Price is consolidating; a move above $3,337.50 could trigger new buy signals. Always trade with strict risk management. Your capital is the single most important aspect of your trading business.   Please note that times displayed based on local time zone and are from time of writing this report.   Click HERE to access the full HFM Economic calendar.   Want to learn to trade and analyse the markets? Join our webinars and get analysis and trading ideas combined with better understanding of how markets work. Click HERE to register for FREE!   Click HERE to READ more Market news.   Michalis Efthymiou HFMarkets   Disclaimer: This material is provided as a general marketing communication for information purposes only and does not constitute an independent investment research. Nothing in this communication contains, or should be considered as containing, an investment advice or an investment recommendation or a solicitation for the purpose of buying or selling of any financial instrument. All information provided is gathered from reputable sources and any information containing an indication of past performance is not a guarantee or reliable indicator of future performance. Users acknowledge that any investment in Leveraged Products is characterized by a certain degree of uncertainty and that any investment of this nature involves a high level of risk for which the users are solely responsible and liable. We assume no liability for any loss arising from any investment made based on the information provided in this communication. This communication must not be reproduced or further distributed without our prior written permission.
    • Back in the early 2000s, Netflix mailed DVDs to subscribers.   It wasn’t sexy—but it was smart. No late fees. No driving to Blockbuster.   People subscribed because they were lazy. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone else is lazy too.   Those who saw the future in that red envelope? They could’ve caught a 10,000%+ move.   Another story…   Back in the mid-2000s, Amazon launched Prime.   It wasn’t flashy—but it was fast.   Free two-day shipping. No minimums. No hassle.   People subscribed because they were impatient. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone hates waiting.   Those who saw the future in that speedy little yellow button? They could’ve caught another 10,000%+ move.   Finally…   Back in 2011, Bitcoin was trading under $10.   It wasn’t regulated—but it worked.   No bank. No middleman. Just wallet to wallet.   People used it to send money. Investors bought it because they saw the potential.   Those who saw something glimmering in that strange orange coin? They could’ve caught a 100,000%+ move.   The people who made those calls weren’t fortune tellers. They just noticed something simple before others did.   A better way. A quiet shift. A small edge. An asymmetric bet.   The red envelope fixed late fees. The yellow button fixed waiting. The orange coin gave billions a choice.   Of course, these types of gains are rare. And they happen only once in a blue moon. That’s exactly why it’s important to notice when the conditions start to look familiar.   Not after the move. Not once it's on CNBC. But in the quiet build-up— before the surface breaks.   Enter the Blue Button Please read more here: https://altucherconfidential.com/posts/netflix-amazon-bitcoin-blue  Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/ 
    • What These Attacks Look Like There are several ways you could get hacked. And the threats compound by the day.   Here’s a quick rundown:   Phishing: Fake emails from your “bank.” Click the link, give your password—game over.   Ransomware: Malware that locks your files and demands crypto. Pay up, or it’s gone.   DDoS: Overwhelm a website with traffic until it crashes. Like 10,000 bots blocking the door. Often used by nations.   Man-in-the-Middle: Hackers intercept your messages on public WiFi and read or change them.   Social Engineering: Hackers pose as IT or drop infected USB drives labeled “Payroll.”   You don’t need to be “important” to be a target.   You just need to be online.   What You Can Do (Without Buying a Bunker) You don’t have to be tech-savvy.   You just need to stop being low-hanging fruit.   Here’s how:   Use a YubiKey (physical passkey device) or Authenticator app – Ditch text message 2FA. SIM swaps are real. Hackers often have people on the inside at telecom companies.   Use a password manager (with Yubikey) – One unique password per account. Stop using your dog’s name.   Update your devices – Those annoying updates patch real security holes. Use them.   Back up your files – If ransomware hits, you don’t want your important documents held hostage.   Avoid public WiFi for sensitive stuff – Or use a VPN.   Think before you click – Emails that feel “urgent” are often fake. Go to the websites manually for confirmation.   Consider Starlink in case the internet goes down – I think it’s time for me to make the leap. Don’t Panic. Prepare. (Then Invest.)   I spent an hour in that basement bar reading about cyberattacks—and watching real-world systems fall apart like dominos.   The internet going down used to be an inconvenience. Now, it’s a warning.   Cyberwar isn’t coming. It’s here.   And the next time your internet goes out, it might not just be your router.   Don’t panic. Prepare.   And maybe keep a backup plan in your back pocket. Like a local basement bar with good bourbon—and working WiFi.   As usual, we’re on the lookout for more opportunities in cybersecurity. Stay tuned.   Author: Chris Campbell (AltucherConfidential) Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/   
    • DUMBSHELL:  re the automation of corruption ---  200,000 "Science Papers" in academic journal database PubMed may have been AI-generated with errors, hallucinations and false sourcing 
    • Does any crypto exchanges get banned in your country? How's about other as Bybit, Kraken, MEXC, OKX?
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.