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kuokam
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Posts posted by kuokam
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Let's wrap things up in search of THE TRUTH some where between all the opinions here :
1- provided you know how to read it, the DOM is a must for ultra short time scalpers
2- swing and long term traders can completely ignore the DOM and trade successfully on TA + indicators.
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I know market and volume profiles, but profiling in the Dom is new to me. Please explain.
So, you pirated/stole it--nice.You talked about "professional traders" and that they never look at charts. My guess is that you really do not know any, but that you have heard this and it sounds cool. In fact though, I do agree that many do not, but no one who relies on a DOM only would use NinjaTrader either. The reason is simple: NT has no built-in profiling capabilities in the DOM, so all you have is price flicking up and down. Most pros at the floor use XTrader or T4 (in fact that's all you see at the CME), both of which have the ability to see where volume is transacting. This is an integral part of using the DOM, otherwise you have no good idea of the actual prints (a tape that can consolidate volume at price is useful, but a standard 80 to 100 line T&S is useless for prints, because they never show up as they are too fast, and is good for tempo/rhythm only).
Pros may not trade off the chart in the sense that a typical retail trader would, but at the CME, NYSE, etc., traders there have access to charts up on screens all day long. You think they don't look at them to get a quick visual of how the day is progressing? I could not trade effectively without the DOM, but this notion that professional traders never look at a chart is silly.
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FWW
"Gold Prices Are Being Manipulated and Here's What To Do About It
By Keith Fitz-Gerald,Chief Investment Strategist
The latest from Keith Fitz-Gerald If you've ever suspected gold prices are being manipulated, you're not alone--and you're right, they are.
The world's biggest traders have bet heavily on gold which is why they're now pulling out all the stops to get what they want and laugh their way to bigger bonuses.
Today, I want to talk to you about who "they" are and share a few tricks you can use to capitalize on their momentum without being taken to the poorhouse.
Here's how to play the game to win..."
not really - but thoughts might be....no one wants to own gold in the future...
no one trusts their counter parties to deliver, so paper trades below physical....
evil manipulators....
sellers finding liquidity where they can....
Whats the long term spread between spot and future?
I dont know, but i am sure Zdo you will have some doom and gloom idea that will be good food for thought to look forward to.....
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So you took the $49 initiation course and a seminar with him, I guess. How long did it take after that for you to be able to see and act from the Dom ?
Sure ,I was doing research a while ago on something else and happened to come across this site during a webinar I was watching.
I learned that Charts, indicators, oscillators , tick counts etc, etc do not work over time because they are always showing the past.......in order for all that stuff to print on a chart it has to have already happened.
This guy talks this way. If you think about it , it all makes perfect sense.
Most professional day traders DO NOT use indicators and charts to trade off of.... they use DOM , order book and they read tape.
They look at charts maybe once a day just a reminder of where the high/low from previous sessions were and a few key levels but thats it.
They know where the "dumb money" retail traders like us are going to be in at. They know that many use the indicators I mentioned. So they will be looking to fade your move.
If you do research you will find that most prop trading firms will not even let new traders look at charts until they can be profitable trading the order book.
As a day trader the past is irrelevant, you need to know what is happening NOW right at this moment , not 5 minutes ago , not a hour ago .....RIGHT NOW.
There are a few other sites that are good on this information but this is where I started.
John ( owner of the site) is awesome at explaining this and demonstrating this.
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Wow! what a man- thread !
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Can you elaborate a bit in which way?
This website changed my life. -
Absolutely. Would be difficult to read it this clear directly on the DOM.
What are you using for charting bathrobe? Personally I find graphical representations like this much easier to look at than the constant flickering of the DOM. -
I say hotep brother !
You could say that. Kemet, or the land commonly known today as Egypt, had a concept of Maat as a means to describe all of existence. But so did many aboriginal cultures. Maa = truth.Maa-maaticos --> Maatematics --> Mathematics
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Okay, will search your material.
Thanks
Kuokam, I don't think you will be able to make any sense of the DOM without specialized software like the kind I've developed. In fact, I never was. I've been on the record here stating that.First, I don't think you'll be competitive against the traders you'll be going up against who have better tools (and then the robots too). Second, I don't know anyone who could process that information.
I believe that if you don't have specialized tools for this that you're better off ignoring this stuff and focusing on something else.
On the other hand, if you have valid tools then it can be quite useful. Koukam, you can search my posts or read my blog for things to watch for. Important to keep in mind, you can't see these patterns with naked eye. Just staring at DOM would be a huge waste of time..
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I totally agree that the Dom might be of great help when scalping. Just need some couple of basic rules but all I hear is spend time watching. What do I look for? How long does it take to know if the thong is for me?
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What about the guy who displays the 200 order just to lure you into the trade and then pulls his order before hitting you and go beyond? Or the robot that splits a 1000 order in 100 parts, that go unnoticed to many? This is real world DOM.
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If you need more confirmation before taking the trade, then the more ticks the better. If you want in earlier, then 1t chart best.
Please clarify........................
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So, it is a trade off between accuracy and timeliness.
If you're set up for 1kt bars, then the probability that any given set of bars is going to be followed by another of the same type is 100%, if that's all you expect, which has nothing to do with whether or not 2 rising ticks are going to be followed by another uptick. What is more important is the message you get from two upticks followed by an uptick rather than a down tick.Which leads back to what you're looking for in the first place. If, for example, you're looking to trade breakouts thru resistance, then you'll watch the ticks to see where they stall and retreat, stall and retreat, stall and retreat. Then if and when they break through that level, there's your entry. This will depend in part on the activity level, i.e., is there a sudden increase in tick activity just before the next attempt to break through whatever level price stalled at? Or are the ticks just drifting aimlessly? If you follow bars that are aggregates of multiple ticks, not only will you not see any of this, you'll be too late to take the scalp, if that's what you want to do. If you decide to do more than scalp, then a time bar may be of greater benefit.
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I was the first to call for a cease fire here.
Now, I don't see what was promoted on this very thread.
Because "All I want here is for these attacks to cease and just let my post contributions stand on their own merit". Change TL user and stop promoting and the attacks stop and his post stand on their own merit - simple right.TL owners are weak in this regard and have in the past tended to side with the vendors.
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I think I hear you, but I do believe the probabilities of 2 1000 tick bars being followed by 1 1000t bar are greater and are more significant than those of 2 upticks being followed a another tick up.
I wouldn't call it "Master's advice", just an acknowledgement of the reality of an auction market. No, a 1t move is not representative of where price is headed, but then neither is a tick bar, regardless of the number of ticks it represents. By following the trades, however, you will get a sense of what price is doing at the moment, which, if you're sensitive to it, will suggest where the support and resistance levels are and whether buyers or sellers are exerting the greater pressure. A tick chart is, after all, just a graphic representation of a time & sales display, which can be used as well. -
Problem aggravated, imho. Why hide? If he is doing some thing wrong, then the mods should intervene and sanction him accordingly. Otherwise he deserves the treatment of all accepted TL members who abide the the forum rules.
If you are not here to sell or promote then create a new TL user and post freely without the hassle.Problem solved?
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Master's advice as always with the Phoenix
.Please correct me.
Why price moves? because buyers and sellers don't agree on the price at a level, so it has to move from that level till the one where the actors agree and a deal is made.
Now I don't understand how a 1 tick move can be representative of where price is headed. I have watched it some times and find them to be too choppy, more than a 1 min chart, which I find difficult to trade on, even when scalping.
Before you start, a word of advice. Actually, several words. If you don't know why price moves one way or another, it won't make the slightest difference whether you use 20t or 44t or 140t or 233t or 3675t.If you do know why price moves one way or another, all you need is 1t. Anything else is a bar. And if you know why price moves, you know that price doesn't move in bars.
If you don't know why price moves one way or another, then you need . . . a 1t, in order to find out.
If you never figure it out, then you ought to find something else to do with your time and especially your money.
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Thank you. Must do my home work.
Take a 70T chart as an example. If you decrease the number of ticks by half (35T) the chart will print more bars. Likewise; if you double the number of ticks (140T) the chart will print fewer bars. 35T is going to be a faster chart than a 140T chart.I trade the TF contract with various scalping strategies. During the opening 60-90 minutes of the regular session open I may run a 70T chart. As trading volume decreases I may speed up the chart to 40T. As the regular session close nears, and volume picks up, I may slow down the chart to 60T. Someone else trading a different strategy (even another scalper) may want to run an even faster chart... say 20T. We are both looking for an optimal speed that fits our strategy.
If you are familiar with the GC or 6E then I would invite you to experiment with different tick values. You'll learn more about tick charts by experimenting than from any lengthy explanation that I could provide.
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What is a faster chart? a slower chart? Take for instance GC or 6E to illustrate.
Thanks
Someone with the intent of employing fast trading strategies (me) will want to use a faster chart. For someone who is employing a strategy that seeks larger price swings a slower chart would (may) be preferred.It depends on the strategy, the market traded, and current market conditions... which I think was being expressed by the previous posts.
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All this flow of compliments don't tell me how to better trade futures.
May we re read the title of the thread.
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Hi 4everMaat, is the Maat in your screen name related to Egypt in some way?
I agree. The 2 month one is ok. You could even do overlapping 2 month ones, every month if you wanted to, except december. Always combine Dec/Jan or Nov/Dec.Did you post the new contest yet?
And does a trader have to use a new demo account, or can they use an existing account, even if there have been trades on it?
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Thanks Roger.
Now, what is the main advantage you find in tick charts over time charts?
Yes, it would depend on the instrument you trade. Intraday, the ES might move in a range of 80 ticks and, if you looked at Crude Oil or Gold futures (CL or GC), you could very well see a daily range of 300 ticks. While the ES tick value is $12.50, there are only 4 ticks to the point. CL and GC have a tick value of $10 but there are 10 ticks to the point.If we agree that a market that doesn't move cannot make money for anyone then isn't it logical that the more a market moves intraday the more opportunity there is for taking profit? There are lots of futures markets that offer this...good consistent smooth up and down volatility every day...but the ES isn't one of them.
Hope this helps....
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Unearthing a dino here
Still a margin between 22 and 223! Just for one product. There must be a general rule (of thumb?) for how to set tick chart.
Hi Ketmoney, I think you probably didnt get the answer you expected as it is a little too general... let me add my two cents here...I like tick charts... actually on futures I trade YM and use 22T charts... thats because I do very fast trades... so you may want to experiment this numbers on tick charts as they are quite popular : 22 , 55 , 110 , 233... always I do have a 5 min chart for some aerial trend view... cheers Walter.
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Roger, what is the optimal nomber of ticks for intraday charts? or does it depend on what object you are trading ?
As long as there can be bucket shops in the Forex, there WILL be bucket shops in the Forex. Not every broker will trade against you, but good luck taking a broker's word for it.Every trader has their favorite broker and I'm not going to promote mine here, but I used Interactive Broker for a while back when they were promoting $4.80 RT commissions. Every time I needed to speak to them, I got a recording. They never called me back until the next day...and then billed me $30 for the phone call!!! No thanks.
Tick charts are an important fundamental chart type that millions of traders use. IB does not provide tick data, period. I would never consider any broker that is stuck in the 1990's. Good accurate unfiltered tick data is essential to me and many others. So, IB will ne technology They'll never see my business again....but that's just my opinion, of course.
Reading Depth of Market
in Day Trading and Scalping
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I was just trying to reach a consensus for us to move forward. If you know better just tell us. You are not my teacher to be asking me to define this or that. Go ask Mr google or your dictionary. If you include all the intraday traders, the other (higher) time frame traders remain. Tell me their use of the DOM?