[jaturner]

Hello Guys, I am sure everyone is getting the hang of this SST like myself. I have a quick question that I am sure TJ can help me with. I am using Ninja to trade and I prefer to trade the Range Bars instead of ticks. I have no reason why, rather than I started on Range with HVMM and have gotten very comfortable with them.

My question is what range would be similiar to a 233 Tick. I use a 6 range for the EUR/USD & The Cable but I was wondering what some other people were using out there and if I maybe should be checking for a different range.

Thanks,

Jim

[Tiobingo]

Jim,

Thanks for starting this post. I too like to use range bars. My question would be if anyone has found a way to get more data. I use tradestation and find that the available data is very limited so it's hard to gain confidence from the limited results of my backtesting. I'm curious what others are doing in regards to this.

[tjnoon]

Hey guys,

Thanks for starting this thread. Hopefully it will evolve into a great resource for everyone. Range bars are not that well understood by most traders. Jim, I don't think that one could really compare a 233 tick chart with a range bar chart. They are just too different. First of all, each market is different. A 233 EURUSD would not be the same as a 233 Dow eMini for example. But besides that, range bars are based on a range breaking out, right? Tick bars are based on the actual ticks flowing through the market; bids being hit and offers getting lifted. (Do a quick google search for a thorough explanation of each.) You'll notice with range bars that they can move sideways for a long time, and then break out and really trend for a long time, or so it seems. Check the time stamps on those bars though. You'll see how some take a long time to print while others print very quickly. I think if you're going to trade range bars, you have to forget about tick and timeframe.

Does anyone else agree or disagree? This in interesting. Personally, I don't have a ton of experience with range bars. I actually prefer tick charts. I like the tick counter that lets me know when a bar will be finished and a new one will start. You can never really have that sort of thing with a range bar. Moreover, I haven't reallly seen a compelling difference, where range is superior to tick. Maybe it is, but I'm waiting for someone to demonstrate that to me. I'm not down on range. I just prefer tick charts. But that's what makes a market, right?

[tjnoon]

As far as data goes, I suppose all you can do is back test the limit that TS or NT gives you and then continue to forward test. You can build up a good record of trades fairly quickly. Within a few months, you can have hundreds of trades and a hands-on recollection of the actual experience of living those trades. That kind of thing is invaluable. That's one of the things that makes the UTA priceless, by the way.

[jaturner]

TJ,

Thanks for the explanation. It makes total since. Funny that I have now been trading the 5min Eur/Usd trade plan. It has been on a killing. I am still not a fan of time charts but as they say "If it aint broke don't fix it"

JT

[Tiobingo]

I agree with jaturner. It seems the 5 minute chart with eurusd has been unstoppable. It seems counter intuitive given how dynamic SST is and how undynamic a time based chart is. I am now very curious about other 5 minute charts with some of the other major pairs. Has anyone started testing any of those yet? I wonder what TJ is up to. Also, my curiosity is having me think about some other timeframe charts, like a 3 minute. Or if that is too small, maybe a 7 or 10 minute. I'll let everyone know if I come up with something.

[BlowFish]

Jim try putting an ATR (average true range) indicator on your 233 tick chart for the period you are interested in that should give you a good feel for a value you might want to use. Of course Constant volume, constant range, constant tick and constant time bars all have somehwhat different characteristics. It is a data sampling issue (what do you hold constant to sample one of the other variables) how you sample the data will determine what is easier to see and what gets 'filtered'.

Not quite sure what this has to do with Ultimate Trade Analyser but I don't really UTA so that's no big surprise.

[Tiobingo]

BlowFish, thanks for the idea. If I can take the liberty of answering your question about UTA, the SST is the newest and coolest (and quite frankly I'm hitting home run after home run with it) trade system by NetPicks. The UTA is the trade tool that NP teaches us all to use in analyzing our trades, learning the new SST system and creating our tradeplans with. Since so many of us UTA users are now SST members, I think that's probably why there has been such an influx into this 'UTA' specific forum.

I've been testing the EURUSD 5 minute chart with the UTA and like many of the members posting in this forum, I have not been a big fan of time based charts. But I am learning, with my use of the UTA tha the 5 minute chart is very effective using SST with EURUSD. Best of all, it's simple and consistently is profitable. Great stuff!!