[Rande Howell]

Though few people come to trading with this set of habits, the good news is that they can be developed. It gives a strong framework to strive for. Thanks Tim.

Rande Howell

[zdo]

Originally Posted by Tams »

Discipline is a dirty word.

Discipline is a negative word...

Discipline is about not doing something you want to do.

Nobody ever looks at "Discipline" in a positive light.
that's why Discipline is such a difficult thing to do.


Take a look at the teenager who just got his driver's license.
he wants to drive fast,
but everybody is telling him not to.
he needs to exert tremendous mental force to control his urge to drive fast.

Take a look at the teenager who just met his first GF.
he wants to have sex,
but everybody is telling him not to.
he needs to exert tremendous mental force to control his urge to have sex.

If you focus on discipline,
you will never get it.
you will break down.
you will always be violating the rules.
you will always be sabotaging yourself.


My 2 cents...
throw the discipline out of the window.
start living your life the way you want to.
drive as fast as you want,
have as much sex as you can,
trade recklessly... Darwin will take care of the rest.

Discipline is often about sticking to a previous choice regarding a known conflict.
I’ve been saying the following for years now, and good reception is running at about 3% (no coincidence?) . Best way I’ve found to see discipline “in a positive light” is to flip it up and use any ‘need’ for discipline as a very important signal
“If you have to apply discipline more than one or two times a month in your trading, then something is fatally (I brutally just added fatally) out of alignment between you and your methods.”

Not saying discipline doesn’t have it’s place, especially developmentally, but in the end mindfulness / awareness is vastly more valuable in trading/ dealing with Threat Modulation than the kind of 'discipline’ being dropped into at least one post in almost every dam trading thread on the planet…

[FulcrumTrader]

As a prior military aviator, I do fully understand how the "Blue Angels" and other elite groups (working in life or death situations) develop advanced psychological capabilities (THERE.....I won't use the term Discipline just for TAMS!) in their training programs.


THEY use VISUALIZATION methods combined with small segmented practical (and highly repetitive) training exercises............

YouTube - ‪Blue Angels teamwork (part 2 of 2)‬‏

YouTube - ‪Blue Angels teamwork (part 2 of 2)‬‏

[FulcrumTrader]

For Traders….Check out the level of performance the Blue Angels are committed to. They undergo intense screening and training. Visualization, contingency planning, attention to detail and repetitious mental rehearsal shape their outstanding results!

What kind of preparation are we committed to?


WHY do they use Visualization techniques? .......because you have to defeat negative current psychology with visions of a new potential reality, that shape new constructive psychology. You have to build a BELIEF that certain tasks are possible for you (creating new constructive psychology) BEFORE you are actually able to do them. You do have to BELIEVE before you can ACHIEVE......so that a proper constructive psychology is working FOR YOU instead of old unconstructive psychology working against you as you operate within the desired reality (trading live).

[TheNegotiator]

I think that it's a really good point that we are open to many possibilities while trading. To visualise the various scenarios is one way. Playing through plans for various different outcomes will cover more bases and help you be more prepared for what can happen and so hopefully it will help you be more profitable overall. Preparation is so important. The real key is to not remain "married" to your trade or belief about what the market 'should' be doing. It's about let the market show you what it is doing.

[peterjerome]

[QUOTE=TimRacette;122014]For those serious about trading for a living, the following list of traits uncovers traits found in every highly successful trader. Realize that 1% of the people who play this game take 99% of the profits. That means 99% of people who call themselves “traders” are forking over all their money to the 1% of serious and consistently profitable traders.

tim, there are many voices here but most have nothing to say. you are an exception.
your #2 was the final obstacle i had to overcome to successfully earning my living trading.
thank you for your post.
peter

[Qiman]

Originally Posted by zdo »

Discipline is often about sticking to a previous choice regarding a known conflict.
I’ve been saying the following for years now, and good reception is running at about 3% (no coincidence?) . Best way I’ve found to see discipline “in a positive light” is to flip it up and use any ‘need’ for discipline as a very important signal
“If you have to apply discipline more than one or two times a month in your trading, then something is fatally (I brutally just added fatally) out of alignment between you and your methods.”

Not saying discipline doesn’t have it’s place, especially developmentally, but in the end mindfulness / awareness is vastly more valuable in trading/ dealing with Threat Modulation than the kind of 'discipline’ being dropped into at least one post in almost every dam trading thread on the planet…

For decades I have looked at "discipline" as compassionate caring, whether it is about a child or one's self. Ultimately, it is based on AWARENESS of what actually works in improving the quality of life, including the quality of trading. Once these aware decisions are made, the only way conflict arises is if awareness is obscured.

Decades ago while in my twenties, friends would comment that in some ways I was like a Spartan, in that I didn't seem to struggle with some of the things that they did, like drinking too much. To me, it was all about awareness of how I felt when I did or did not do certain things. With food, if I ate certain foods I didn't feel so great, so with that awareness the choice was easily made to feel good and eat well. I don't need discipline around pastries or coffee, I have no desire to consume them. Same with how I use my money, impulse purchases don't make me happy and are not a temptation.

With trading, having certain firm rules based on awareness is a process, for some it takes years. The layers of personality can be quite complex, but all parts of you eventually have to come to see the wisdom of the rules, all parts of you have to be on the same page. Trading is a tough enough game without internal warfare going on!

Some of the best traders are those who have come back from a catastrophic loss, including bankruptcy. For these traders the lessons were permanently learned, and there is no temptation to let a loser run or become over-leveraged. In one sense, no discipline is even needed now.

[zdo]

Originally Posted by Berzerk »

"One strategy to capitalize on winning trades is to scale out of your winners. A loss should always be exited in full at your predetermined stop point, however when a trade is going in your favor, having multiple targets allows for the trade continue working in your favor.

Exiting half the position at your first target, half of your remaining position at a second target, and the last portion (1/4 of the original) at a third and final target can be an effective way to capitalize on your winning trades"

All nice but isn't it cutting profits short? I mean scaling out can be part of the trading plan that works for somebody, but still when your stop is hit, you have the whole position on and you take a hit on the entire position.
When the trade is going your way, you're earning money on part of your position only.

I've seen this advice on scaling many times and still have the impression that it's against profitable trading.

It’s freaking pandemic how much sizing, scaling, stops, targets content is generated about trading as if it could be applied ubiquitously across all types of systems, when actually the advice is EXTREMELY system specific. But, on the other hand, to generally say that scaling (in or out, in profit or loss) is bad is like saying the capacity to vary load in any arena is bad.
Unfortunately he didn’t get system specific… but to give him the benefit of the doubt -
I suspect he is just using those parameters as a example to illustrate the more general point which is:
Learn to scale appropriate to your own system(s)!
Scaling is actually sizing. System appropriate scaling (which btw may mean no scaling) is a crucial element of high performance trading.