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Trading Psychology How do we learn to conquer our fear and greed? Discuss the mental aspects of the game.

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Old 08-12-2016, 05:37 AM   #1

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There Is Something Intriguing About Trading

“In my experience trading takes a very important and somewhat rare personality trait which is: the ability to see the next logical step and to then get it done. If this ability is lacking you will always be behind.” – Garachen (Source: Elitetrader)

Why Is Trading a Good Money-making Vehicle?
It’s a level playing field. Everybody is welcome.
You don’t have a boss to control you.
You need only a PC and Internet connection.
You can make money whether the market goes up or down.
The more experience you’ve, the better you become.
The starting capital is minimal.
You’ve great money management flexibility. You stay in control.
You choose when to trade and when not to trade.
Profits come naturally when you’re away from your system.
You can coach others including your family members.

There Is Something Intriguing About Trading
Most members of the public don’t believe they can trade successfully. They’ve been convinced that they can only give their money to professional funds managers to manage, without knowing that they can do this themselves. Your parents don’t have trading secrets to give you. Your school doesn’t have trading secrets to give you. The society don’t have the secrets to give you.

While there are pros who can manage your money successfully, it’s true that when you’ve correct trading methodologies and use them faithfully, you can even do better than the so-called pros in terms of percentage returns.

Forex trading is a good business, but many people don’t understand it. It’s controversial because the public opinions about it are unfair and warped. Most members of the public understand other types of business, save Forex.

There are ways to make small and consistent profits on monthly basis, which become considerable on annual basis. Since most people don’t have experience and others around them don’t have the knowledge, they’re afraid to get in. The reality is; successful traders are just normal people like me and you.

There are good trading systems you can use to make money, and those who use these systems aren’t smarter or better than you in any way. The only difference is that those who use good trading systems have the willingness to attain riches through discipline.


Conclusion: Trading is different from investing. As a trader, you buy and sell within days or weeks, but an investor may hold a position for months or years. The greatest market speculators are faithful to strategies that give them an edge. They stick to those strategies when they work and when they don’t work. I pray that your fortitude will not be shaken in trying times. Your true trading potential lies beyond your innate gifts.

The article is concluded by this quote:

“Trading is not a sin, but trading without knowing what you are doing can lead to a lot of problems. Trading, in and of itself, is not considered as gambling…. However, gambling is considered to be foolish. Trading without adequate knowledge of the markets and self is foolish because, by doing so, you are gambling… There is a certain amount of self-knowledge needed to choose the proper trading method.” – Andy Jordan

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Old 08-12-2016, 12:27 PM   #2

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Re: There Is Something Intriguing About Trading

Why Is Trading a Good Money-making Vehicle?

It’s a level playing field. Everybody is welcome.
No it isn't. a level playing field. If it was, even people who write articles would have an even chance. But yes, the casino always welcomes you in.... unless you start winning too much.

You don’t have a boss to control you.

This statement ( like most of your statements) gives the game away. You can't trade. I got a boss- ME. And trust me, he's a bastard who is never satisfied with current performance.


You need only a PC and Internet connection.

Every loser has a PC and an internet connection

You can make money whether the market goes up or down.

Except for the 90% who can't.
The more experience you’ve, the better you become.

No. Repeating the same mistakes over and over is experience but it's only useful if you learn from it. Time served in and of itself means nothing.

The starting capital is minimal.

There's a heavy investment of time required, and time is far more valuable than money, particularly if that time is mainly spent under stress and anxiety, which it will be for everyone. Takes years to become relaxed in this trade -relaxed.. better substitute that for calm.. not exactly relaxing is it?

You’ve great money management flexibility. You stay in control.

You're in the business of luring suckers into gambling their money in a market that is notorious as the least likely successful avenue for any trader, let alone complete beginners which are your target market, Writing these useless articles in the hope that it gives you a veneer of some kind of respectability is frankly very transparent to those of us who can actually trade.

If someone attacked me in this way I'd be utterly outraged, but your experience and background suggests hoping it will go away by ignoring it is usually the best tactic.

Let's take a vote:

A -Tallipax continues on as usual

B- Tallipax shows his true colours just like the people he works with.

You can coach others including your family members.



Yeah,, did you ever do pyramid selling.... ? Would have suited you to Tee.
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Old 08-12-2016, 03:28 PM   #3
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Re: There Is Something Intriguing About Trading

I am amused...

Mitsu, give the guy a break; everyone has to eat in this business...

There will be those that are pulled into this sort of advertising, and there is nothing you or I can do about it. It has been and will continue to be a part of the trade. As with all things in the business: "due diligence is required". If you are a 'noob" and have been impressed by much of what A75 posts here, and you do not have the where-with-all to discern the "helpful" from the "not so helpful", well then listen up...

A75 has posted a lot of trading pablum on this site. For the most part it's harmless, and he may be running a business that is on the up-and-up. I have no opinion on that matter, nor do I care to take the time to form a valid opinion on the matter. Much (if not all) of what he has posted here is about so called "super traders"..."elite traders"... and the like. Well, let's just be honest: "you ain't that, and in all probability (even if you are successful) you will never be "that".

In short, because I don't care enough to elaborate further (any more than A75 does) you will probably fail, because you don't have a boss; all it takes is a computer and an internet connection; it takes very little capital to get started; and best of all... you can train your family to become rich... just like you.

Come on man; it's laughable... you're killing me...
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Old 08-15-2016, 02:05 PM   #4

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Re: There Is Something Intriguing About Trading

Thanks for the article. The intended message was passed and perfectly understood.
Mit, you always look for errors and try to make someone's piece irrelevant. Give folks a break.
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Old 08-16-2016, 09:00 AM   #5
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Re: There Is Something Intriguing About Trading

Quote:
Originally Posted by vladtitov151 »
...
Mit, you always look for errors and try to make someone's piece irrelevant. Give folks a break.
Mits is beyond. His cynicism and bitterness sees beyond and cuts through. His contributions are, imo, more valuable than the 'positive' candy posts.

btw When an author doesn't appear to know the difference between trading and investing it is quite reasonable to question the relevance of "someone's piece".


We have a new GSD puppy. He will eat ANYTHING But that doesn't mean we should let him eat just anything.

Noobs are like puppies. They will eat ANYTHING. But that doesn't mean we should feed them all kinds of crap. But we do.

We feed them lists of rules. Gann's 18 rules of trading... magically reinvented over and over again... each reinvented list with a small personal twist, addition, or deletion that only has meaning to the list maker temporarily and to no one else. And each list is published as if it is applicable across the board - when in actuality, it is only salient to a small set of systems. *

* like at http://www.traderslaboratory.com/for...ead-stock.html

Last edited by zdo; 08-16-2016 at 09:07 AM.
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Old 08-17-2016, 05:50 AM   #6

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Re: There Is Something Intriguing About Trading

Quote:
Originally Posted by vladtitov151 »
Thanks for the article. The intended message was passed and perfectly understood.
Mit, you always look for errors and try to make someone's piece irrelevant. Give folks a break.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Request denied.


https://www.google.co.uk/webhp?gws_r...=forum+meaning


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Todays' flavour is Jamaica jerk
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Old 08-22-2016, 09:38 AM   #7
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Re: There Is Something Intriguing About Trading

I am the worst jerk on TL .... but ...

"Part of engaging online is dealing with jerks. It’s part of the deal. Back in the old days when people got up on soap boxes to vent there were jerks then too. No doubt many a slur was hurled in many a public square back in the day along with many a fist.
In most respects we are probably a much more courteous [world] today, even with the relative anonymity and ease of communication via the Internet. But the sensitivity level of some has just gone off the charts in recent years. Some people cannot dismiss jerks any longer. They must be protected from views and words which do not fit their worldview. The dialectic orchids must be shielded from the harsh breezes of reality and – gasp – people who think “gender studies” is a bunch of BS." Nick Sorrentino

You got to be pretty serious and intolerant to tell someone (like Mits) to just shut up because he thinks a post is stupid or counterproductive or downright harmful. Believe me, there are thousands upon thousands of positive fluff lists and pieces strewn across years and years of trading forums for noobs and struggling traders to lap up. One of our latest fads in here is to resurrect 3 year old dead topics as if they are brand new discussions.

imo, these mushy lists have their place. Unfortunately, their place is forever locked at the first cusp between losing and surviving at trading and even there they never have anything but an allopathic, symptom suppression purpose... which, btw, pretty much sums up what the 'voice of trading' is and does.

Statoids:
1 if a noob and/or struggling trader 'needs' gushy, positive pabulum posts - they likely ain't going to make it anyways.
2 if a noob and/or struggling trader is not sufficiently and consistently risk averse within each and every trade that goes into the red on his/her own, no amount of reading about it in someone's 'new' list of rules will bring sudden realization and fix it.
3 Statistically - those who start learning trade selection first are forever at a disadvantage...
...


Here is a list of substance I respect in posts:

1 questions. Rarely are answers provided btw. You can assess the quality of questions on forums. Note that the VERY BEST questions get no replies at all... Still - I encourage peeps to broadcast the question and simultaneously carry the attitude that " the question is the answer"

2 acknowledgement of polarity and oscillation. These 'helpful' cream of wheat lists don't do that. Notice that Mits red replies to these mush lists (above and at http://www.traderslaboratory.com/for...tml#post203735 etc) reveal the polarity and oscillation that the list maker wishes to conceal. From my perspective, outright denial of the biphasic tendencies that hold, then switch to another 'tendency' - both internally and price patterns of trading instruments - is rampant.
One of the main hypnotic tenets of the 'voice of trading' is that traders should have a list of rules (and if a potential trade does not precisely fit those rules don't take it, etc). I have taught for years that traders (noobs too (who btw have already been trading their whole lives and don't need fkn elementary school all over again)) have the capacity to categorize the various states that a market oscillates/mutates between and that they need to develop sets of rules for each of those states. Bluntly - One 'list' will keep you at the first cusp fo ever

3 acknowledgement of 'stuck' states. This one is closely related to #2 above. Don't have time to go into it now

4 open with the pain

Quote:
Your pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses
your understanding.

Even as the stone of the fruit must break, that its
heart may stand in the sun, so must you know pain.

And could you keep your heart in wonder at the
daily miracles of your life, your pain would not seem
less wondrous than your joy;

And you would accept the seasons of your heart,
even as you have always accepted the seasons that
pass over your fields.

And you would watch with serenity through the
winters of your grief.

Much of your pain is self-chosen.

It is the bitter potion by which the physician within
you heals your sick self.

Therefore trust the physician, and drink his remedy
in silence and tranquility:

For his hand, though heavy and hard, is guided by
the tender hand of the Unseen,

And the cup he brings, though it burn your lips, has
been fashioned of the clay which the Potter has
moistened with His own sacred tears.
Khalil Gibran
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Old 08-22-2016, 12:19 PM   #8
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Re: There Is Something Intriguing About Trading

Ha! As usual, I had to look up definitions for some of the words used, but all-in-all... nicely stated Mr. Zdo.

I have a single rule; not a rule written on a stone tablet handed down from "on high" (so to speak of the "voice of trading"). It is quite simple, and only serves as a personal reminder to my own idiosyncratic tendency of over aggression. It consists of an 8 X 10 framed statement, that hangs on the wall above my trading desk. It is as follows:

WAIT... WAIT FOR IT STUPID

To my way of thinking... there are no rules, only observation, consideration and context. To try to define trading as a protocol of "if-then" statements that can be transferred from one person to the next, is frothy at best, and utterly ambiguous at it's worst. Most of what is posted here is the later rather than the former, but both are problematic.

Edit... I realize that I'm being ambiguous in what I've said. Truth of the matter is... there is no hope for you unless you can solidify "ambiguity" into something coherent to your own understanding. The "market" is filled with ambiguity, and you need to learn to deal with it. Sorry man... more ambiguity... I can't stop. So, in all manner of helpfulness and good faith, I will shut the fuck up.
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Last edited by jpennybags; 08-22-2016 at 02:15 PM.
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