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Apparently not.

 

-river

 

Jack or Todd never charged. I was under the impression Todd did this as a pay-it forward from Jack. John sees it as pay me.

 

Where is the track record? I asked about live trading to see him in action. It is very easy to annotate looking through the rear view mirror.

 

You have got to be nuts to pay for this, I will wait for a free recorded version.

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The track record exists in the many students who have studied my program, and those they have referred. Beyond that I have no motivation to prove or disprove anything to you or anyone else.

 

As for Todd and Jack passing it on for free - I think the track record of "failure to succeed" for most of those students is quite obvious.

 

Furthermore, if you think I'm going to give up three weekends with my family out of the goodness of my heart, you would be incorrect. Maybe you should contact Spyder. I'm more than happy to step aside if he's willing to offer the same to you for free.

 

Quite a few folks have already signed up. As for you getting your hands on a copy. Good luck with that.

 

Best to you in your journey.

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The track record exists in the many students who have studied my program, and those they have referred. Beyond that I have no motivation to prove or disprove anything to you or anyone else.

 

As for Todd and Jack passing it on for free - I think the track record of "failure to succeed" for most of those students is quite obvious.

 

Furthermore, if you think I'm going to give up three weekends with my family out of the goodness of my heart, you would be incorrect. Maybe you should contact Spyder. I'm more than happy to step aside if he's willing to offer the same to you for free.

 

Quite a few folks have already signed up. As for you getting your hands on a copy. Good luck with that.

 

Best to you in your journey.

 

 

No need to get defensive. This is a public forum and that is my opinion. Spyder left for family reasons.

 

I have no doubt there will be a copy available for download.

 

Good luck to you.

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...
I can't understand why anybody who trades this method successfully would charge to teach it. He'd make more money trading it than teaching it. I understand if somebody doesn't want to fully share this method's indepth secrets, because he doesn't want to enable undeserving people, but to charge some unfortunate people who already spent a lot of time, energy, and hope seems to me wrong; a scam.

 

People, don't buy it!

 

EDIT: I'm curious: how much does this class cost?

Edited by cnms2

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I can't understand why anybody who trades this method successfully would charge to teach it. He'd make more money trading it than teaching it. I understand if somebody doesn't want to fully share this method's indepth secrets, because he doesn't want to enable undeserving people, but to charge some unfortunate people who already spent a lot of time, energy, and hope seems to me wrong; a scam.

 

People, don't buy it!

 

EDIT: I'm curious: how much does this class cost?

 

Evidently $500. No word on whether or not that price includes a set of steak knives.

 

-river

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Evidently $500. No word on whether or not that price includes a set of steak knives.

 

-river

That's really peanuts!

 

A quick calculation, if you master this method even slightly, and average 1 ES point a day:

- $12,500 a year

- 5 points a week, so you make $1,000 a month

- you can decide to double the number of contracts every $2,000, or 2 months, and use the power of compounding:

- in 2 months: 2 contracts ($25,000 a year)

- in 4 months: 4 contracts ($50,000 a year)

- in 6 months: 8 contracts ($100,000 a year)

- in 2*n months: 2**n contracts ($12,500*2**n)

- but, you can easily average 4-6 points daily in 1-3 trades

 

:)

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I can't understand why anybody who trades this method successfully would charge to teach it.

 

Good question. When I first started out I didn't charge a dime. My first student, who was a long-term friend, still trades with me in my Skype room every day. He's done well.

 

BUT, I learned something important during that first training experience. This stuff is not easily transferred. And I ended up causing him much confusion, answering his questions with riddles, etc...much like many of us experienced with Spyder. It was not effective for either of us.

 

Later on, after my success, other friends started crawling out of the woodwork. (don't they always?) I realized that with a family, an elderly mother who lives with us, and young children that needed a lot of my attention, that I couldn't possibly continue training in the same manner. This is where I broke away from Spyder's teaching methods and developed my own system/syllabus for teaching. I have and maintain a blog for each class, I give regular homework assignments which are graded BY HAND and returned to the student, I hold regular Skype meetings where we take time to walk thru the assignments and I demonstrate the thought process/analysis that one should be considering as each bar develops thru the day. And yes, MANY of my students have watched me trade live right here in my home. I pour maybe 20-30 hrs a week into training. And we not only discuss the method, we discuss the value of entry/exit points, high risk vs low risk analysis, trade sizing, etc. It goes far far beyond anything that is presented here on TL or other forums. Maybe you should ask my new student who profited over $10,000 in the months of June/July this summer if it was worth his time. I know his answer.

 

You call me a scam - so be it. Truthfully it doesn't matter to me what you or anyone else here thinks of my method for doing this. The only opinions that matter to me are those of the students who have worked with me and those that I have helped.

 

edit: And of course I make more money trading it than teaching it. But unfortunately I'm not skilled enough to do both at the same time. If I'm going to teach it, then each student deserves my full attention. We don't just annotate random days - each assignment is chosen for a very specific reason - to learn something that they can (and will) use again over and over. But I also place a high value on my personal time. Since most of the work around my training is in the evenings, I consider there to be a value on that time that it takes away from my family. If someone doesn't understand that value - then they can certainly choose to look elsewhere. No harm done.

Edited by jbarnby

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Good question. When I first started out I didn't charge a dime. My first student, who was a long-term friend, still trades with me in my Skype room every day. He's done well.

 

BUT, I learned something important during that first training experience. This stuff is not easily transferred. And I ended up causing him much confusion, answering his questions with riddles, etc...much like many of us experienced with Spyder. It was not effective for either of us.

 

Later on, after my success, other friends started crawling out of the woodwork. (don't they always?) I realized that with a family, an elderly mother who lives with us, and young children that needed a lot of my attention, that I couldn't possibly continue training in the same manner. This is where I broke away from Spyder's teaching methods and developed my own system/syllabus for teaching. I have and maintain a blog for each class, I give regular homework assignments which are graded BY HAND and returned to the student, I hold regular Skype meetings where we take time to walk thru the assignments and I demonstrate the thought process/analysis that one should be considering as each bar develops thru the day. And yes, MANY of my students have watched me trade live right here in my home. I pour maybe 20-30 hrs a week into training. And we not only discuss the method, we discuss the value of entry/exit points, high risk vs low risk analysis, trade sizing, etc. It goes far far beyond anything that is presented here on TL or other forums. Maybe you should ask my new student who profited over $10,000 in the months of June/July this summer if it was worth his time. I know his answer.

 

You call me a scam - so be it. Truthfully it doesn't matter to me what you or anyone else here thinks of my method for doing this. The only opinions that matter to me are those of the students who have worked with me and those that I have helped.

 

edit: And of course I make more money trading it than teaching it. But unfortunately I'm not skilled enough to do both at the same time. If I'm going to teach it, then each student deserves my full attention. We don't just annotate random days - each assignment is chosen for a very specific reason - to learn something that they can (and will) use again over and over. But I also place a high value on my personal time. Since most of the work around my training is in the evenings, I consider there to be a value on that time that it takes away from my family. If someone doesn't understand that value - then they can certainly choose to look elsewhere. No harm done.

 

 

You are a scam. You keep coming back to justify your actions. Any successful trader that is making money would not give a crap. Why dont you just be honest and say you dont make money trading you make it teaching other peoples methods.

 

As far as students watching you trade and others making $10k over the summer is a great sales pitch.

 

Be aware! He is a scam.

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You are a scam. You keep coming back to justify your actions. Any successful trader that is making money would not give a crap. Why dont you just be honest and say you dont make money trading you make it teaching other peoples methods.

 

As far as students watching you trade and others making $10k over the summer is a great sales pitch.

 

Be aware! He is a scam.

 

You are right! He is chasing this money, he ain't making money trading.

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So I assume you are a skilled trader since (according to you) none of them give a crap. My goodness....and all this time I thought it was possible to be a good trader AND also provide a service. Thanks for opening my eyes!

 

BTW, since you're so sure you'll get a download of my class, then I'm sure you already have several hundred recordings of my other classes in your possession. Hope you enjoyed them. ;)

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So I assume you are a skilled trader since (according to you) none of them give a crap. My goodness....and all this time I thought it was possible to be a good trader AND also provide a service. Thanks for opening my eyes!

 

BTW, since you're so sure you'll get a download of my class, then I'm sure you already have several hundred recordings of my other classes in your possession. Hope you enjoyed them. ;)

 

Spoken like a true salesman.

 

Every time you respond it does more damage than good. Stop trying to justify!

 

Seriously, a successful trader who is making money from trading would not care. You seem to care a little bit too much.

 

Actions speak louder than words!

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this women get it

I have been trading for the past fifteen years using many different indicators — you name it and I have probably traded it.

 

Triangles

Elliott Waves

MACDs

Moving Averages

Trend Identifiers

 

They were all part of my tool kit. There was only one HUGE issue. I would have numerous winning trades, only to be knocked backwards by a couple of losers. Trading was a constant uphill struggle — I would take three steps forward, two steps back.

 

Frustration was often my best friend!

 

 

Then a friend told me, look trading is simple — WE make it HARD. Traders have to learn to trade volume and price, not just the color of the indicator. Volume and price LEADS all other indicators.

 

WOW, if only it could be that easy!

 

 

I have discovered that trading really is that easy using 3 very simple steps:

 

 

Candlestick charting because it is easier on the eyes and traders can easily identify all the key price points without squinting.

 

Volume LEADS price, it really is that simple. However, most traders don’t understand where to analyze the volume. I analyze volume at two critical areas:

 

Support and Resistance area

Overbought and Oversold areas

...

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Spoken like a true salesman.

 

Every time you respond it does more damage than good. Stop trying to justify!

 

Seriously, a successful trader who is making money from trading would not care. You seem to care a little bit too much.

 

Actions speak louder than words!

 

I don't know how you people think.

The way I see it, Spyder and Jack have generously shared a huge amount of information. I actually read it. However, having tracked down quite a few of the "old hands" from ET, some of which have been doing this for a decade (!), I had a hard time finding people that even claimed they were consistently profitable, let alone coming close to the results talked about in the threads. Some of them still papertrade, believe it or not. So, if you cannot figure this out from the threads (and it is my opinion that it is very difficult, too much info that is downright wrong, or slightly off, or contradictory, too many misunderstandings through language, too many nuances), you might spend years and thousands of hours trying unsuccessfully to figure it out. It is still a mystery how Spyder ever did it, given that he learned it from Jack whose communication skills are somewhat challenging.By the way, a lot of the info that some of the old timers post as answers to questions is downright wrong, even though "free".

So-what is your time worth? At least 20 bucks per hour one would hope? You might end up with the equivalent of an Ivy-league tuition in opportunity cost for these "free" threads that "pay it forward". Some of the people that spend years on the threads seem to have ended up in a psychological state that I would not wish to pay forward to my worst enemy.

 

So, if somebody offers to spend something like 20 hours with you for a measly 500 bucks, the only valid questions IMO would be 1. does he know what he is talking about? and 2. can he actually explain this so that I will be able to trade the method profitably, with some practice? If the answer is No, then walk away. If the answer is yes, even thousands of dollars would obviously not be too much, and much cheaper than studying the "free"stuff which is not free because it is hugely expensive in the most precious of all resources, time.

 

Having said that, there is also a kind of whiny aspect to that demand that somebody spent time with you for free,a certain sense of entitlement, like a petulant child. Nobody owes you anything (especially not in the trading environment), and why should anybody spend hours of his time for free? I would do it, but for friends and family, and certainly not for people that think I somehow owe it to them.

 

As to the logical leap that "anybody who charges me anything is a vendor and cannot trade", I urge you to consider Don Miller...he makes millions per year, fully audited, and he teaches people for a fee (he gives that fee to charity, but that is his personal choice and besides the point).

 

Just my two cents- am not getting in a flame war, for the reason you guessed- waste of time...

 

:)

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Quite the impassioned post.

 

Is this a thinly veiled effort to defend a stealth vender mentor or a sincere attempt to help those who struggle to successfully trade the price/volume relationship?

 

-river

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Quite the impassioned post.

 

Is this a thinly veiled effort to defend a stealth vender mentor or a sincere attempt to help those who struggle to successfully trade the price/volume relationship?

 

-river

 

:):):):)!!!

You figure it out...

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Quite the impassioned post.

 

Is this a thinly veiled effort to defend a stealth vender mentor or a sincere attempt to help those who struggle to successfully trade the price/volume relationship?

 

-river

Neither I think it is a keenly assesment of thread participants so far.

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As to the logical leap that "anybody who charges me anything is a vendor and cannot trade", I urge you to consider Don Miller...he makes millions per year, fully audited, and he teaches people for a fee (he gives that fee to charity, but that is his personal choice and besides the point).

 

That is the point Don Miller has a track record and is happy to supply it. He is well known and respected in the market. John is a nobody claiming to be this successful trader. Why does he not publish broker statements for the past 6 months. Very easy to blank out account numbers.

 

If $500 is small change, please publish your own broker statements. Jack has done it. You should have nothing to hide.

 

Proof is in the pudding, the rest is just words.

 

Please don't respond without broker statements it is just meaningless dribble.

:)

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It would be interesting to find out:

 

1. Who believes that the futures Hershey / Spydertrader method is profitable (not if you are profitable, but if you think it is profitable even if you don't know yet how)? It is.

 

1. a. Who believes it is wildly profitable? It is.

 

2. Who believes that any trading course will teach you a sure method of making money? I don't.

 

2.a. Who believes it will make you rich? I don't.

 

3. Who believes that somebody who charges to teach you trading is profitable trading? I don't.

 

3.a. Who believes it is wildly profitable? I don't.

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@river: If you can't figure it out yourself, you can find out from vienna for $2 (for his time). :)

 

I pay more than $20 an hour my gardner ...

 

:):):):)!!!

You figure it out...

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It would be interesting to find out:

 

1. Who believes that the futures Hershey / Spydertrader method is profitable (not if you are profitable, but if you think it is profitable even if you don't know yet how)? It is.

 

1. a. Who believes it is wildly profitable? It is.

 

2. Who believes that any trading course will teach you a sure method of making money? I don't.

 

2.a. Who believes it will make you rich? I don't.

 

3. Who believes that somebody who charges to teach you trading is profitable trading? I don't.

 

3.a. Who believes it is wildly profitable? I don't.

 

1. Agreed

2. Agreed

2a. That depends on the individual and the contracts size

3. Agreed. Not profitable

3a.Back to contract size, and the definition of wildly profitable

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    • Date: 15th April 2024. Market News – Negative Reversion; Safe Havens Rally. Trading Leveraged Products is risky Economic Indicators & Central Banks:   Markets weigh risk of retaliation cycle in Middle East. Initially the retaliatory strike from Iran on Israel fostered a haven bid, into bonds, gold and other haven assets, as it threatens a wider regional conflict. However, this morning, Oil and Asian equity markets were muted as traders shrugged off fears of a war escalation in the Middle East. Iran said “the matter can be deemed concluded”, and President Joe Biden has called on Israel to exercise restraint following Iran’s drone and missile strike, as part of Washington’s efforts to ease tensions in the Middle East and minimize the likelihood of a widespread regional conflict. New US and UK sanctions banned deliveries of Russian supplies, i.e. key industrial metals, produced after midnight on Friday. Aluminum jumped 9.4%, nickel rose 8.8%, suggesting brokers are bracing for major supply chain disruption. Financial Markets Performance:   The USDIndex fell back from highs over 106 to currently 105.70. The Yen dip against USD to 153.85. USOIL settled lower at 84.50 per barrel and Gold is trading below session highs at currently $2357.92 per ounce. Copper, more liquid and driven by the global economy over recent weeks, was more subdued this morning. Currently at $4.3180. Market Trends:   Asian stock markets traded mixed, but European and US futures are slightly higher after a tough session on Friday and yields have picked up. Mainland China bourses outperformed overnight, after Beijing offered renewed regulatory support. The PBOC meanwhile left the 1-year MLF rate unchanged, while once again draining funds from the system. Nikkei slipped 1% to 39,114.19. On Friday, NASDAQ slumped -1.62% to 16,175, unwinding most of Thursday’s 1.68% jump to a new all-time high at 16,442. The S&P500 fell -1.46% and the Dow dropped 1.24%. Declines were broadbased with all 11 sectors of the S&P finishing in the red. JPMorgan Chase sank 6.5% despite reporting stronger profit in Q1. The nation’s largest bank gave a forecast for a key source of income this year that fell below Wall Street’s estimate, calling for only modest growth. Apple shipments drop by 10% in Q1. Always trade with strict risk management. Your capital is the single most important aspect of your trading business. Please note that times displayed based on local time zone and are from time of writing this report. Click HERE to access the full HFM Economic calendar. Want to learn to trade and analyse the markets? Join our webinars and get analysis and trading ideas combined with better understanding on how markets work. Click HERE to register for FREE! Click HERE to READ more Market news. Andria Pichidi Market Analyst HFMarkets Disclaimer: This material is provided as a general marketing communication for information purposes only and does not constitute an independent investment research. Nothing in this communication contains, or should be considered as containing, an investment advice or an investment recommendation or a solicitation for the purpose of buying or selling of any financial instrument. All information provided is gathered from reputable sources and any information containing an indication of past performance is not a guarantee or reliable indicator of future performance. Users acknowledge that any investment in FX and CFDs products is characterized by a certain degree of uncertainty and that any investment of this nature involves a high level of risk for which the users are solely responsible and liable. We assume no liability for any loss arising from any investment made based on the information provided in this communication. This communication must not be reproduced or further distributed without our prior written permission.
    • The morning of my last post I happened to glance over to the side and saw “...angst over the FOMC’s rate trajectory triggered a flight to safety, hence boosting the haven demand. “   http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/topic/21621-hfmarkets-hfmcom-market-analysis-services/page/17/?tab=comments#comment-228522   I reacted, but didn’t take time to  respond then... will now --- HFBlogNews, I don’t know if you are simply aggregating the chosen narratives for the day or if it’s your own reporting... either way - “flight to safety”????  haven ?????  Re: “safety  - ”Those ‘solid rocks’ are getting so fragile a hit from a dandelion blowball might shatter them... like now nobody wants to buy longer term new issues at these rates...yet the financial media still follows the scripts... The imagery they pound day in and day out makes it look like the Fed knows what they’re doing to help ‘us’... They do know what they’re doing - but it certainly is not to help ‘us’... and it is not to ‘control’ inflation... And at some point in the not too distant future, the interest due will eat a huge portion of the ‘revenue’ Re: “haven” The defaults are coming ...  The US will not be the first to default... but it will certainly not be the very last to default !! ...Enough casual anti-white racism for the day  ... just sayin’
    • Date: 12th April 2024. Producer Inflation On The Rise, But Will Earnings Hold Demand Steady?     Producer inflation rose slightly less than previous expectations, but the annual figure continues to rise. The annual PPI rose to 2.1% and the Core PPI rose to 2.4%. The NASDAQ and SNP500 end the day higher, but the Dow Jones continues to struggle. This morning earnings kick off with the banking sector including JP Morgan, BlackRock and Wells Fargo. All 3 stocks trade higher during pre-trading hours. The Euro trades lower against all currencies despite the ECB’s attempt to establish a hawkish tone. USA100 – The NASDAQ Climbs Higher, But Is the Growth Sustainable? The NASDAQ was the only index which did not witness a significant decline at the opening of the US session. In addition to this, the USA100 is the only index which is witnessing indications of a bullish market. The price has crossed onto a higher high breaking the resistance level at $18,269. The index is also trading above the 75-Bar EMA and at the 65.00 level on the RSI which signals buyers are controlling the market. However, a similar large bullish impulse wave was also formed on the 3rd and 5th of the month and was followed by a correction. Therefore, investors need to be cautious of a bearish breakout which may signal a correction back to the 75-bar EMA (18,165). The medium-term growth and its sustainability will depend on the upcoming earnings data.   Bond yields declined during this morning’s Asian session by 18 points, which is positive for the stock market. However, even with the decline, bond yields remain significantly higher than Monday’s opening yield. This week the 10-year bond yield rose from 4.424 to 4.558, which is a concern. If bond yields again start to rise, the stock market potentially can again become pressured. 25% of the NASDAQ ended the day lower and 75% higher. This gives a clear indication of the sentiment towards the technology sector and reassures traders about the price movement. Another positive was all of the top 12 influential stocks rose in value. Apple, NVIDIA and Broadcom saw the strongest gains, all rising more than 4%. Producer inflation read slightly lower than expectations, however, the index continues to rise. The Producer Price Index rose from 1.6% to 2.1% and the Core PPI from 2.1% to 2.4%. Therefore, it is not indicating inflation will become easier to tackle in the upcoming months. For this reason, investors should note that inflation and the monetary policy is still a risk and can trigger strong bearish impulse waves. EURUSD – The Euro Declines Against Major Currencies The European Central Bank is attempting to concentrate on the positive factors and give no indications of when the committee may opt to cut rates. For example, President Lagarde advises “sales figures” remain stable, but the issue remains they are stably low. Officials said the decline in prices generally confirms medium-term forecasts and is ensured by a decrease in the cost of food and goods. Most experts continue to believe that the first reduction in interest rates will happen in June, and there may be three or four in total during the year. Due to this, the Euro is declining against all currencies including the Pound, Yen and Swiss Franc. The US Dollar Index on the other hand trades 0.39% higher and is almost trading at a 23-week high. Due to this momentum, the price of the exchange continues to indicate a decline in favor of the US Dollar.   Always trade with strict risk management. Your capital is the single most important aspect of your trading business. Please note that times displayed based on local time zone and are from time of writing this report. Click HERE to access the full HFM Economic calendar. Want to learn to trade and analyse the markets? Join our webinars and get analysis and trading ideas combined with better understanding on how markets work. Click HERE to register for FREE! Click HERE to READ more Market news. Michalis Efthymiou Market Analyst HMarkets Disclaimer: This material is provided as a general marketing communication for information purposes only and does not constitute an independent investment research. Nothing in this communication contains, or should be considered as containing, an investment advice or an investment recommendation or a solicitation for the purpose of buying or selling of any financial instrument. All information provided is gathered from reputable sources and any information containing an indication of past performance is not a guarantee or reliable indicator of future performance. Users acknowledge that any investment in FX and CFDs products is characterized by a certain degree of uncertainty and that any investment of this nature involves a high level of risk for which the users are solely responsible and liable. We assume no liability for any loss arising from any investment made based on the information provided in this communication. This communication must not be reproduced or further distributed without our prior written permission.
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