[Spydertrader]

Originally Posted by SK0 »

[Un]Fortunately, there is no test for them.

The market provides the ultimate test for confirming (or invalidating) any hypothesis. Ramora has provided a description of how he trades the market. You may interpret his words a number of ways. Test each way against what the market shows you each day. In such a fashion, everyone can arrive at the exact meaning of what has been described - without any confusion or ambiguity.

I say to you all again, the market provides crystal clear information on each and every five minute bar. The market provides this information in a binary fashion, at all times - without exception.

To those who have chosen to post their charts and receive feedback along the way, keep up the great work. You may not yet even realize it, but your efforts have moved you closer to the end of the road.

Good Trading to you all.

- Spydertrader

[dkm]

Originally Posted by Spydertrader »

I say to you all again, the market provides crystal clear information on each and every five minute bar. The market provides this information in a binary fashion, at all times - without exception.
- Spydertrader

Crystal clear in terms of open, high, low, close and volume traded, I agree. But I fail to see how it is crystal clear what "fractal" the market is operating on and where we are in that fractal volume sequence. If this is what you mean by "crystal clear", then would you please give an example of how we are meant to see this?

Thank you

[ptunic]

I know this is a cop-out answer but imo there just isn't any 1 "holy grail" sentance, paragraph, or even 10 pages Spydertrader could post (well, maybe 200 pages ) that would fully answer this. If you look at some old threads on the previous website, Spydertrader many times went bar-by-bar and wrote 5 detailed sentences with multiple charts per bar explaining the context, mode, sequences etc (Romanus himself was a leading participant in these and did a great job asking questions and providing analysis as well).

I think this can be helpful, and at the end of the day it is binary (or deterministic, or crystal clear, or whatever you want to call it) but the caveat is there are dozens of factors with 10000s of combinations. But much like in chess if you learn how to use your bishop to pin the opposing king in one square, it translates to you easily able to learn similar ways to pin the opponent with other pieces and other squares. So one pattern really solves about 1000 combinations or more.

If Spydertrader went through this process, besides of course being exceedingly unpleasant for him and frustrating for many of us (remember the "pulling teeth" threads on an earlier site?), our rate of learning would just be too slow. Far faster to teach someone how to fish than throw them fish each day. Hense the emphasis on us looking at the process. What the lateral drill really is trying to show you is how to test your hypothesis by reviewing things that look kind of similar and notice subtle differences and if/when they consistently change the outcome. We can take the same lateral drill process and apply it to other laterals (non-conforming) for example.

In other words as nearly every successful trader (even of other methods than this) has told me, tremendous screen time and debrief is required. It's kind of like riding a bicycle in that respect, you can give someone a 50 page manual explaining physics or you can say get on the horse, yeah you will fall down at first, but you will learn how to ride faster than the person in the classroom.

I think it's kind of like a jigsaw puzzle, even though you are usually just making very tiny gains in your knowledge, that sometimes don't feel like huge victories, over time it starts to add up and the big sets of pieces start to fit in with each other. It is a war of many skirmishes (I guess like anything in life).

I also do think it is possible to learn this in a reasonable amount of time, as rs5 for example has demonstrated. I'm not sure her secret besides great focus + hard work but it is working

This is all just my opinion of course.

[cnms2]

Originally Posted by ptunic »

I know this is a cop-out answer ... This is all just my opinion of course.

Your post is well intended, but unfortunately of no use to those who spent years of hard working unsuccessfully trying to profitably trade these methods. Obviously doing the same thing and expecting different results is ... insanity. Some kind of a better approach is needed.

[rs5]

Tuesday 23 February 2010

[rs5]

Originally Posted by ptunic »

.......as rs5 for example has demonstrated.

LOL ptunic. I enjoyed reading your post with the analogy to chess and bicycle riding. But how did my name get in there??? Please know that I am still LEARNING! And as you can see in my charts, often confused! The proof of the pudding will come when I can translate charts to points on a consistent basis

[PointOne]

Could someone please walk through their MADA for the opening 7 bars of Tuesday 02/23 ES. (Needless to say, a brisk walkthrough by Spydertrader would be very welcome too.)

I'm especially interested in when you know to be short based on sequences (prior to or during the 10am* bar7).

Based on my understanding of gap adjustments, 09:45 bar4 made a new high and was not an obvious FTT of any container (it looks if anything like a P2), making 10am appear to be a FT3.

Now FT3's don't exist if you have correct sequences, hence my question.

Many thanks.

(* Bar open times.)

[PTVtrader]

Originally Posted by PointOne »

Could someone please walk through their MADA for the opening 7 bars of Tuesday 02/23 ES. (Needless to say, a brisk walkthrough by Spydertrader would be very welcome too.)

I'm especially interested in when you know to be short based on sequences (prior to or during the 10am* bar7).

Based on my understanding of gap adjustments, 09:45 bar4 made a new high and was not an obvious FTT of any container (it looks if anything like a P2), making 10am appear to be a FT3.

Now FT3's don't exist if you have correct sequences, hence my question.

Many thanks.

(* Bar open times.)

How do you handle VE's on decreasing volume ?