[Ingot54]

This thread could be a great launch pad for nutty ideas, disguised as revealing serious risk to freedom ... or could it be vice-versa?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...umQT58A#at=153

[Ingot54]

George Carlin has long been an outspoken loudmouth comic, but putting aside his liberal expletives, I find he makes his point well.

George Carlin Illuminati New World Order Exposed - YouTube

George Carlin Illuminati New World Order Exposed - YouTube

[Ingot54]

I don't know anything about the above - just tossed in there to stir the pot.

But can this stuff be ignored?

Somewhere between the nutso's and the lobbyists, stands Ron Paul.

Where does he stand in the spectrum of truth in all of this?

Ron Paul "It's Time We Quit This! It's Trillions Of Dollars We're Spending On These Wars! Debate pt6 - YouTube

EDIT: You'll find it all here anyway: http://whatreallyhappened.com/

[pa18]

Originally Posted by Ingot54 »

This thread could be a great launch pad for nutty ideas, disguised as revealing serious risk to freedom ... or could it be vice-versa?


The Story of Your Enslavement - YouTube

"... A series of farms, where human farmers owns human livestock ... " then shows the pope

Nice one Ingot, food for thought

[pa18]

Originally Posted by Ingot54 »

I don't know anything about the above - just tossed in there to stir the pot.

But can this stuff be ignored?

Somewhere between the nutso's and the lobbyists, stands Ron Paul.

Where does he stand in the spectrum of truth in all of this?

Ron Paul "It's Time We Quit This! It's Trillions Of Dollars We're Spending On These Wars! Debate pt6 - YouTube

EDIT: You'll find it all here anyway: WHAT REALLY HAPPENED | The History The US Government HOPES You Never Learn!

My two cents and maybe off topic ---

The demise of US in the short and medium term is a certainty. So does it make sense to pull back all resources, get their house in order, then start over. When I hear US funding this and that overseas, I've gotta ask wtf ....

I'm no US citizen but I think that's what Ron Paul wants to do if he gets to power, seems like a genuine chap ... for a politician

[Ingot54]

Originally Posted by pa18 »

My two cents and maybe off topic ---

The demise of US in the short and medium term is a certainty. So does it make sense to pull back all resources, get their house in order, then start over. When I hear US funding this and that overseas, I've gotta ask wtf ....

I'm no US citizen but I think that's what Ron Paul wants to do if he gets to power, seems like a genuine chap ... for a politician

Yes, PA18 - there is always a voice of reason ... but it depends on your point of view too, and what you see as "reason."

To me it is fairly plain, and instead of rambling, I will copy/paste from the Australian version of The Daily Reckoning:

************************* **

A Five-Step Plan Towards Making the World Right Again
By Greg Canavan

The gold standard removes the determination of cash-induced changes in purchasing power from the political arena. It's general acceptance requires the acknowledgement of the truth that one cannot make all people richer by printing money. The abhorrence of the gold standard is inspired by the superstition that omnipotent governments can create wealth out of little scraps of paper.


- Ludwig Von Mises

Gold is not necessary. I have no interest in gold. We will build a solid state, without an ounce of gold behind it. Anyone who sells above the set prices, let him be marched off to a concentration camp. That's the bastion of money.


- Adolf Hitler

In a moment I'll reveal a 5-step plan that will ensure investors and retirees are rewarded not punished for saving.

A plan that also provides a stable economic environment for businesses to plan for the future – without having to second guess central bank market manipulations.

But first, consider these facts about how serious America's debt situation now is:
The US Government ran a budget deficit of $1.24 trillion in 2008, $1.44 trillion in 2009, $1.58 trillion in 2010 and is on track for a deficit of around $1.3 trillion in 2011.


Over the same timeframe, the Federal Reserve slashed interest rates to zero and increased its asset holdings from $951bn at the end of 2007 to $2.85 trillion as of 27 July 2011. It simply printed money to purchase the assets.


Not surprisingly then, currency in circulation in the US economy – the fuel for inflation – has jumped from $773.9bn in 2007 to $1.03 trillion as of 27 July. That's a 33 per cent surge in 3.5 years.


Over the same time frame, the economy has grown just 5.2 per cent. That's in 'current' dollars. Adjusting for official inflation, which is more than likely bogus, the US economy has not grown since the third quarter of 2007.
So all this money printing by the Fed and debt issuance by the government has achieved absolutely nothing – apart from enriching the ruling class to the detriment of just about everyone else.

Money printing and fiscal largesse in other parts of the world have also only had fleeting impacts on economic growth. The message seems obvious. All the stimulus and increase in government debt is useless. It has a very short term and misleading effect on the economy. And it leaves a lasting legacy of an increase in a nation's total debt levels.

Despite this obvious fact there is an unbelievably ingrained tendency for investment professionals, mainstream economists, journalists and society as a whole to ask what the government is going to do to fix things.

If you're of that persuasion, here's a newsflash – government and central bank policy is the problem. Until society as a whole starts to recognise that, we'll continue heading down the slippery slope that we're on.

But instead of criticising, I'm going to propose a modest and simple solution – a return to the principles of sound money.

At it's most basic, having a 'sound' monetary system involves removing a government's ability to influence, manage or interfere with a nation's currency. In removing the government from the role of monetary management, a sound money policy puts it in the hands of the market.

That sound money advocates handing monetary policy over to the market might alarm you. After all, the 'free market' cops its share of blame for causing all sorts of economic problems. But not many people stop to think of this simple fact – there is no free market in money.

Central banks set the price of money and regulate that price every day. And as the evidence shows, they have done a pretty bad job. Taking the ability to create and set the price of money out of their hands would be a giant step forward in improving the economic system.

To do this, gold needs to be officially recognised as a tool in setting monetary policy. But it needs to be done correctly.

Returning to a gold standard should not involve tying gold to paper currencies at a fixed-price level. That's what the Bretton Woods agreement came up with after WWII and it was doomed to failure. Recognising there is no such thing as absolute stability is the key.

Ludwig von Mises raised this issue in Human Action:

The gold standard is certainly not a perfect or ideal standard. There is no such thing as perfection in human things. But nobody is in a position to tell us how something more satisfactory could be put in place of the gold standard. The purchasing power of gold is not stable. But the very notions of stability and unchangeability of purchasing power are absurd. In a living and changing world there cannot be any such thing as stability of purchasing power... It is an essential feature of money that it's purchasing power is changing.'

With that in mind, a modern gold standard could be implemented via a series of steps over a number of years. In summary, these steps would be:

Step 1 – Firstly the gold market needs to be a 'free' market. At the moment the US manages the US dollar against gold via the activities of the major investment banks in the futures market. The devaluation of the US dollar is 'controlled' although as more and more dollars come into existence, the ability to exert this control is diminishing. Operating this way is like conducting monetary policy back-to-front. It creates all sorts of false price signals and distortions. (See Step 4 for the right way to do it).

Step 2 – In a free gold market, central banks must stop buying their government's debt and print money to buy gold instead. Doing so over a period of years would help set a stable free-market price of gold and provide them with a sound asset on their balance sheet. We have no idea where gold would rise to in such a scenario, but let's say it's around US$5,000 an ounce.

Step 3 – National banknotes should promise to pay the bearer in gold. This way citizens have a recognised alternative to paper currency if they don't like the way their govt/central bank is acting. If inflationary policies were followed, people could take their notes to their bank and exchange it for gold. This would drain gold from the central bank and push its price up against the currency in question. It would therefore be a signal to central bankers to pull their head in.

Step 4 – Following this process would mean central banks conduct monetary policy by ensuring their currency trades within a well defined and communicated range. So in the case above, the Fed could manage the dollar within a range of US$5,000 to $5,250 per gold ounce. If gold traded above $5,250, it would signal that monetary policy is too loose. The market would impose discipline. That way we wouldn't have to put up with the arbitrary decisions of a few central bankers – decisions that have caused so much trouble.

Step 5 – Finally, gold must replace the US dollar as the world's reserve currency, or at the very least severely curtail it. This would actually happen in conjunction with the other steps. In reality, the US would not give up this 'exorbitant' privilege easily.

And there you have it. We're sure there are flaws to such a plan, but nothing worse than the current system we have.

The market is forcing some of these changes now. The investment banks are slowly but surely losing their grip on the futures market as their methods become widely known. Many central banks around the world, sick of absorbing surplus US dollars, are now buying gold instead of selling it.

Gold is in the process of re-setting to much higher prices. Or more accurately, national currencies are declining in value against the market's chosen vehicle for sound money – gold. This simply reflects the economic damage and wealth loss over decades of monetary mis-management.

But let's not kid ourselves that a concerted move to sound money policies is going to come from those who stand to lose the most. We'll need a crisis for that.

The way things are going, we might not have too long to wait.

Best regards,

Greg Canavan
Editor, Sound Money. Sound Investments

************************* *********

These things are beginning to stand out a lot more, to a lot more people.
We are being shown the Libertarian way ... but does it have its flaws too?

best wishes

Ingot

[pa18]

Thanks Ingot. I agree with the five step plan in a theoretical sense but will people embrace and implement it? And flaws? Sure, but lesser of two evils comes to mind ...

Another ramble from me (grumble and too many beers lol)

You can see from the recent riots in the UK. Many of course will see the surface and that's all they can see, uneducated thugs destroying things on TV, but has anyone considered that the underlying reason for the turmoil ... 'young' people just angrily dissatisfied with gvt and banks getting away with murder (excess bonuses etc...) . If these people in power can get away with these things, can you see vandals getting away setting fire to police cars and robbing shops. Emulation to the extreme!

Revolution is coming my friend, look at the speed that they riots spread throughout the country --- hard or soft but it will eventually come ... and I hope the white hats win

[MightyMouse]

Originally Posted by Ingot54 »

George Carlin has long been an outspoken loudmouth comic, but putting aside his liberal expletives, I find he makes his point well.

George Carlin Illuminati New World Order Exposed - YouTube

Ingot,

Is he talking about Australia?

MM