[Ranger]

Tax avoidance is good;

Tax evasion is unlawful.

The IRS does have field offices in known tax havens .... for sure! With a large US debt, you can imagine the US is tightening up on it's tax laws ...

[randy1953]

Not really overseas they could careless as long as you file your absolutely fine in Panama.
The IRS does have a field office in Panama city employs 1 IRS agent and he's probably out drinking and pick up young latinos chic than doing any actual work he he.

The only reason why they have a field office is try to fake a real pressence here in Panama.
They have absolutely no authority here, all they can do is refer someone to their main office and go from there. It's really just to show thier face they are here. We Americans that have lived here for sometime think it's a joke.
Randy

Originally Posted by Ranger »

Tax avoidance is good;

Tax evasion is unlawful.

The IRS does have field offices in known tax havens .... for sure! With a large US debt, you can imagine the US is tightening up on it's tax laws ...

[karim0028]

Randy/Other Panama folks,

How do you like life in panama? How did you come about your decision to move from the US to Panama?

I hear great things about it, but have never been there and kind of wondering what drives folks to move there... What are the good, bad and the ugly about Panama...

[randy1953]

There are many answers to that question. The ease of becoming a permanent resident with all the benefits of a retired person and you need not be retired but just show a ongoing income of $1000 per month.

The way the people are here has a lot to do with it. In the US we lost real contact with our neighbors like 50 years ago. In the 50's in the US it was a different world and people were a heck of a lot nicer, much less stress,economy much better. Back then if you just worked at a service station pumping gas you could afford yo buy a home .
Well Panama is just like the 50's were for us except we have all the modern conveniences as he US has.

The veggies and produce tastes a world apart from the Us. The beauty of living in the mountains where the climate is eternal spring like it never gets hot or cold.

The only big negative I have for this country is it rains and rains a lot. If you do not like lots of rain you would never like Panama. It will rain steady every day from March to December however never in the morning which are always nice and sunny but around 2 pm you better be inside because when it rains here it's like a Monsoon rain which is a very hard rain.

Lastly you simply live a much more stress free life here and medical care is great where they really take care of you and is common practice for your doctor to give you his cell phone number.

Also Americans have been here for over 100 years so they are accustom to us and really enjoy our company
Hope that helps..
Randy

[bootstrap]

This is my first post in a long time, and all I have to say about the IRS is to take a line from one of my favorite movies:

"In the matrix there are rules. Some can be bent and some can be broken."

The secret is to know which is which and have a good lawyer.

i am not afaid of an audit, but I would hate to lose.

[nikke]

Originally Posted by hunter1 »

I am a lawyer. I got into trading because a large area of my practice was setting up asset protection plans for traders from the Merc and CBOT.. Some of them taught me how to trade and now that's what I do and only do offshore work for a few on the side. Mainly old clients and their friends.

Rule 1 A U.S. citizen must pay tax on income earned anywhere in the world. Trade station will supply the IRS at the end of the year with your trading information.

Rule 1a. You are not required to pay more than your fair share. You are allowed to take any steps you deem necessary as long as they are with in the law to minimize your taxes.

Ex US companies keep earnings earned outside the US in countries with no corporate taxes. They only pay tax if they return the earnings to the US. This is legal.

Rule 2 Tax court does not work like regular court. You are guilty until you prove you are innocent. This means the IRS seizes first then it is up to you to prove they were wrong to do so.

Rule 3 earnings through a US domiciled entity are deemed earned in the US. EX earn through trade station and get taxed by the US. It does not matter where you actually live.

Use non US broker for trading. For example Saxo bank has good operations. I prefer Hong Kong brokers myself.

Rule 4 For asset protection you must be set up and operating before something happens that makes you want the protection. For example to protect from a lawsuit your assets must have changed title before you received notice of a possible suit. To avoid government seizures the same. Once the IRS or Dept. of Labor knock on your door it is to late to legally transfer assets. The courts will hold you in contempt if they find out about it. Same for lawsuits. You will be held in contempt if you transfer after the cause of action arose.

This means that while the government cannot get your money they can hold you until you bring your money back to the US so they can grab it.

Rule 5 transfers can be on paper . Physical transfer out of US is not needed. Once title is transferred to a non US entity, a corp for example, the corp can move assets at anytime. ( To do this and avoid contempt you must use an attorney that really knows this stuff. It is highly specialized and most lawyers even at the biggest firms have no clue how to do this.

Rule 5a You will be deposed. You do not want to lie. You must be set up in such a way that allows you to tell the truth.

Rule 6 A Plan without the use of a trust some where in the mix can lead to problems.

Hope this helps.

Sounds like sound advice.
But please dont mention "learned to trade" and a bucketshop like saxobank in the same post. Makes the rest of the post smell snake.

[randy1953]

Thank you for this I agree with most of it. However you sound a bit like big brother when your talking about MT4 which is also a trading platform and the most popular one today would actually giver the IRS your trading information from a overseas broker. This is simply incorrect the broker has no obligation to give such info or ant info to the IRS. I believe your also incorrect by saying tradestation because in effect your saying a platform for trading actually has a brain and can be asked to do this. It's just a vehicle for trading purposes?

I do agree with you that you need a trust
I do agree that this has to be set up prior to any trouble in the UA
Lastly rule number 5 is simply illegal. The reason why lawyers do not know this part is if they get caught doing a transfer as such they will go to jail.

You cannot transfer assets once the IRS has you. This is why it's so important not to have anything registered in your own name. The trust should not have you name on it. The bank account you use should not have your name on it. You should have 2 separate trusts with the money going into the first trust and then transferring into the second trust. I do not have the time here but it's in the tax code if set up properly money that has been through 2 trusts when it comes out is NOT taxable.

Happy trading
Randy