[secondmouse]

Thanks, jdevron. I really appreciate everyone's responses on this nerve-racking issue.

[henryduncan12]

Mirror trading: The mirror trading method allows traders in financial markets to select a trading strategy and to automatically “mirror” the trades executed by the selected strategies in the trader's brokerage account. Traders can select strategies that match their personal trading preferences, such as risk tolerance and past profits. Once a strategy has been selected, all the signals sent by the strategy will be automatically applied to the client’s brokerage account. No intervention is required by the client as all the account activity is controlled by the platform. Clients may trade one or more strategies concurrently. This flexibility enables the trader to diversify their risk while maintaining complete trading control of their account at all times.

[futurescalper]

Originally Posted by secondmouse »

I'm new to Forex and have a couple of quick questions. Would appreciate feedback.

I've heard that ECNs are preferable to work with, instead of market makers, because ECNs don't have dealing desks (and therefore no conflict of interest). But I've also been advised that you don't get good fills with ECNs. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
SM

I trade with mb trading's non-MetaTrader Forex in EUR/USD exclusively, using HyperScalper. mb trading is a pure ECN with the following characteristics:
1) Interbank pricing
2) No penalty for small lot size
3) Pay for Limits which gives you a Credit when you add liquidity, which
4) Result in No Commission, when you place order carefully.

They pay a credit equal to 1.95 base currency per $100k forex lot, or any proportional lot size down to the micro lot. For example, in current EURO price, that is 1.95 times 1.3, which is about $2.53 per Forex standard lot ($100,000) PER SIDE.

So, a Forex standard lot, purchased wholesale, buy BID and sell ASK has a Gross profit of $10 for 1 tick, Plus the credit of $2.53 per side, so that's NET approx $15 profit, and the market didn't move at all... (theoretically, if you wait with resting limits to get your fills).

If you use a marketable order, and you "hit" a counterparty, then you pay only 2.95 in base currency per side fully proportional commission. The counterparty gets the liquidity credit in that case, so you want to use Limit orders carefully on their ECN.

Their fees and credits are here:
MB Trading - Pricing

No dealing desk, no restrictions on scalping, and no FIFO restrictions on hedging.

Fill times roughly 0.5 seconds round trip.

Anyway, this is Modern Transparent ECN Forex, and it's a great trading environment.

Just FYI...

[4EverMaAT]

Honestly, as long as the broker gets you in and out of your trades, you will not notice a significant difference between either models, other than spreads which are already fairly competitive these days. And a reputable broker will fill you as the market allows.

Don't get "spooked" solely on the strict terms ECN and Market Maker

[Mysticforex]

Originally Posted by futurescalper »

I



No dealing desk, no restrictions on scalping, and no FIFO restrictions on hedging.



Just FYI...

Your statement on hedging is incorrect. this is copied directly from their site. I couldn't find any information that would lead me to believe one could circumvent FIFO either
( first in first out ).


MB Trading - Stocks Options Futures Forex Online Discount Trading

[futurescalper]

Originally Posted by Mysticforex »

Your statement on hedging is incorrect. this is copied directly from their site. I couldn't find any information that would lead me to believe one could circumvent FIFO either
( first in first out ).


MB Trading - Stocks Options Futures Forex Online Discount Trading

Thanks for pointing that out. I really don't know about Hedging, and I should not have been making that statement, so I apologize.

However, the "FIFO" issue is an accounting issue, and is handled at their back office.

This is not an issue easily explained, but basically, using their MetaTrader (which I don't use), you are able to do LIFO trading "last in, first out". Normally, FIFO restrictions would force you to close the First In, as the First Out.

But all of this evaporates, because not only do they take care of that in the back office, when you are not talking about "deals" in MetaTrader, which are no longer "deals" because they are an ECN. You can buy or sell, at least within a single Forex symbol in any amount and in any order you wish.

I don't use the MetaTrader concept of "deals" but simply Buy and Sell EUR/USD Forex lots. By doing this, I am able to pull my Price Break Even point, or Cost Basis in my favor, and "Nibble" away at the market by taking Partial profits, so that when any "entry" comes into profit, I can close it out. This, incidentally would be considered "LIFO" last in, first out, from the perspective of "deals".

My trading style is strictly LIFO, so I do know that FIFO restrictions, at least within a single Forex pair, are eliminated at mb trading. Basically, using their ECN (aka EXN) it's just like trading on a "real" exchange, like Globex. You just buy and sell, in an unrestricted fashion.

So, ultimately, trading is just Average Buy price vs Average Sell price minus commission, and even commission can be mitigated at mb trading, or eliminated, by their "Pay for Limits" program.

Hope this helps !!

[futurescalper]

Originally Posted by Mysticforex »

Your statement on hedging is incorrect. this is copied directly from their site.

As regards Hedging, I'm not an expert here, but having a long and short position in the same account makes no sense to me anyway. And that practice has been banned, I believe by NFA.

However, as a matter of fact, with 2 accounts, you could certainly have a long position in one, and a short position in another, on the same Forex pair symbol. I know of a guy who specifically had 2 accounts at mb trading for just this purpose. I guess that would accomplish the purpose of hedging... ?

But when we trade Forex on a modern ECN, we are really getting outside of the whole "Dealing Desk" concept, so the "order" of the deals, in the sense of MetaTrader positions, becomes irrelevant. Anyway, my comments and experience with the "MetaTrader world" are limited. I've used mb trading's MetaTrader briefly (but performance was terrible) and so I know that LIFO execution sequences are unrestricted. The last "deal" can be closed "first".

But "modern" trading on an ECN doesn't have the concept of "deals" anymore, and so Forex has finally come into the modern era with ECN's such as mb trading's offering. My trading is called "Nibbling" and consists of hundreds of small transactions, mostly on a "LIFO" basis using Cost Basis Averaging over a wide price range in Euro.

HyperScalper

[Mysticforex]

Originally Posted by futurescalper »

As regards Hedging, I'm not an expert here, but having a long and short position in the same account makes no sense to me anyway. And that practice has been banned, I believe by NFA.

However, as a matter of fact, with 2 accounts, you could certainly have a long position in one, and a short position in another, on the same Forex pair symbol. I know of a guy who specifically had 2 accounts at mb trading for just this purpose. I guess that would accomplish the purpose of hedging... ?

But when we trade Forex on a modern ECN, we are really getting outside of the whole "Dealing Desk" concept, so the "order" of the deals, in the sense of MetaTrader positions, becomes irrelevant. Anyway, my comments and experience with the "MetaTrader world" are limited. I've used mb trading's MetaTrader briefly (but performance was terrible) and so I know that LIFO execution sequences are unrestricted. The last "deal" can be closed "first".

But "modern" trading on an ECN doesn't have the concept of "deals" anymore, and so Forex has finally come into the modern era with ECN's such as mb trading's offering. My trading is called "Nibbling" and consists of hundreds of small transactions, mostly on a "LIFO" basis using Cost Basis Averaging over a wide price range in Euro.

HyperScalper

I am not knocking MB, they have a solid reputation. Just didn't want mis information out there. Yes, one could "hedge" by having 2 accts at any broker. Like you, I have never been big on hedging.

I used to consider myself a decent mid term trader. By mid term I mean 3 days to 2 weeks. While the trade was open I would scalp ( in the direction of my analysis ) .
Now, with FIFO, I just scalp. I'll take another look at MB and see if they offer a demo.
See if the cost averaging would work to better advantage for me.

When the Rules change, we change. We adapt.