[brownsfan019]

Cooter has a good idea there - if you want to get your feet wet, the YM could be a good place to start and then go to the NQ and finally the ES.

Nick - I've always liked trading the ES if nothing else b/c size is not an issue. I like the fact that trading a 50 lot does not mean much to those looking for 'red flags' or the infamous 'stop hunting'. And I like the 12.50/tick. With that, I can make ONE tick and cover all commissions and still make money. Just one tick. It doesn't sound like much, but when you need to exit a trade at +1 tick, you at least made money on the trade. With the NQ/YM, you'll need 2-3 ticks to do the same thing. Just something that works better for me.

[Nick1984]

So once u got your strategy down pat the ES sounds like a much more efficient market for scalpers. If you can cover your positions with a 1 tick gain you could drop 30-50 lots on and go for +5 to +10 and make a healthy living off that. Not bad.

I like cooters idea it sounds very reasonable.

[brownsfan019]

Nick - Here's how I would view the ES in terms of scalping:

+ Able to drop a decent amount of contracts with no problem.
+ If you can do it right, 12.50/tick will work for you.

- To exit a position, it's safe to assume the price must be traded through when using limit orders. Ex: if you are trying to take 2 ticks from your entry, you will actually need it to move +3 in your favor as the 'line' to get filled on the ES is rather large.
- If you thrive on more 'wild' spikes (like ER2), you won't see them on the ES nearly as often. Again, if you need those type of moves, the ES will be hard to trade. If you don't want some wild spikes, like myself, then the ES is a more 'smooth' market in comparison.

I'd suggest testing your ideas out on a simulator, but you need to find one that is realistic to how the ES actually trades. There's too many that assume you get filled if your exit price is just touched. Not so in real-time.

Originally Posted by brownsfan019 »

I'd suggest testing your ideas out on a simulator, but you need to find one that is realistic to how the ES actually trades. There's too many that assume you get filled if your exit price is just touched. Not so in real-time.

Unfortunately, the OpenECry OEC Trader simulator is one of those that is so "loose" that it triggers limit orders as if they were "market if touched" orders.

Pretty poor and shoddy implementation, IMHO. It suckers newbies into thinking that real world trading would match this performance - which, of course , it won't.

I did like the Transact AT simulator (same as Infffinnity) since they actually recognized this limitation and made certain that it either trades thru the level on the sim or sits in the queue for a period of time.

Your real-world expectations and experience may vary either way.

[wsam29]

Start with a market that suits YOUR personality.

They all act differently.

Sit, watch and feel how each market moves. They are like women, no one are the same. Learn their behaviors and slowly trade 1 or 2 lots at a time. The tick value should be irrelevant because once you start adding contracts, they start to go up.

This is part of the learning curve.

[wsam29]

Originally Posted by wsam29 »

Start with a market that suits YOUR personality.

They all act differently.

Sit, watch and feel how each market moves. They are like women, no one are the same. Learn their behaviors and slowly trade 1 or 2 lots at a time. The tick value should be irrelevant because once you start adding contracts, they start to go up.

This is part of the learning curve.

Forgot to mention, don't just limit yourself to the stock index futures.

There are plenty of electronic markets now, not like when I first started. September 1998.

The electronic meats has fairly low volume, but you can use the pit data and enter limit orders on the electronic side and hope to get filled. From what I understand the NYBOT products now are also electronic as well.

Coffee and cocoa, they spike and jump and come crashing down, really crazy market, technicals don't really work in that market. I've only traded cocoa a fee times.

OJ, sugar, they are slow, not really day trading products, but once they move, they can trend for a long time. I still remember buying 5 OJ contracts around 65.00 right before the hurricane. Well lets just say, OJ at the time was near or at its lifetime low, all one had to do was hold it and let the market do the work. *sigh* Those are once in a lifetime type trades that make trader's famous if they make a killing.

Sugar at one time was around 3 cents a pound.

Just don't limit yourself to the popular products.

Just remember, you're also trading against other people and well, lets just say, the moment you enter the trading arena, you are trading against seasoned veterans right off the bat and they will not feel bad about taking your money. Heck I've put a few of their kids through school for sure.

[brownsfan019]

winfred gives some additional options; however, I would suggest any new trader stick to the ES, YM, NQ or ER2. The reasons are for what Winfred quoted - other markets have much lower volume, which can lead to wild spikes, lock downs, etc. You are not going to see lock downs in the main US equity index products. The last thing a new trader's account can withstand is a huge loss in a low volume product.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that just b/c it's electronic, all things are equal. There's a reason why the US indexes are some of the most heavily traded futures contracts daily.

[rock]

YM
reasons already stated by posters