John Carter's Setups: Legit or Lame?

[notouch]

Be realistic people. A trader is by definition someone motivated by money. If he was the charitable type are there not more worthy causes than wannabe traders? Of course he's in it for the money. I don't know and don't care how much profit he makes from his trading but I don't believe anyone would hand out their brokerage statements for other people to inspect.

[jbtrades]

Hubert told everyone in the trading room that his income breakdown is about 50% from the "education business", and 50% from trading. I think Carter's ratio is probably about the same. There is nothing wrong with that, but they are not running trading room to be good samaritans.

[walterw]

My opinion is this : they are very good traders with sound concepts some of their own other borrowed, and they have a vocation to teach and relate with people (its a life style), at the same time make some more money... no sin... I learned a lot from them thought their entries are kinda late... would suggest them try some cci entries jejejeje I personally like how they teach internals... thought actually I am not using them... cheers Walter.

[TRex]

	Quote:	notouch
	Be realistic people. A trader is by definition someone motivated by money. If he was the charitable type are there not more worthy causes than wannabe traders? Of course he's in it for the money. I don't know and don't care how much profit he makes from his trading but I don't believe anyone would hand out their brokerage statements for other people to inspect.

Good point. If one is going to manage other people's money, than providing audited brokerage statements would be a prerequisite. CTA's who manage hedge funds are required by law to do this. Otherwise, the legal liability and implied representations by showing trading statements is not worth the risk for those in the educational business. That is, you're inviting lawsuits; and the fees one earns from teaching don't outweigh the risk from disgruntled students who assumed their performance would be similiar to the teacher.

Anyway, it is well known in the industry Carter makes most of his income from risk free fee based services, not trading. His managed trading track record in the last couple of years has been subpar.

[Reaver]

I said in other posts that if one were truly wanting to help others, they wouldn't charge for it...simply put, if I had made an ungodly amount of money in the markets and was still consistent..in the unlikely event I would disclose all my trade secrets and be truly philanthropic.....I wouldn't charge money...I would be making plenty of money from trading.....money from students would be a drop in the bucket..if I truly wanted my students to succeed I wouldn't be charging them tons of money for lessons..I would be encouraging them to build as much capital as possible.

I donate a bunch of time to the humane society in my area, and I don't charge them for it...why? because I truly have an interest in the animals being treated humanely...no ulterior motives....I don't sell them discounted services.. (**"well, yes Mr Humane society director, I normally charge $40 an hour, but since I want to see your animals treated humanely, I will only charge $20"**)....nope I do it for free, because I am a volunteer and have a true interest in furthering my cause in an unselfish way.

I am all for discussion of trading and helping each other out free....but seriously, no one in their right mind is going to give away their trade secrets...

Same way the casinos do..they'll teach you to play cards...but you aren't going to learn anything of substance from them.

The amount of money a trading edge is worth is actually priceless.....but it is surely worth more than any normal person could afford....It would be like me selling you a Porsche or $20....(rough comparison-lol but you get the point...it just doesn't make sense to do that).

People don't readily train others to compete with them.

[TRex]

	Quote:	Reaver
	I said in other posts that if one were truly wanting to help others, they wouldn't charge for it...simply put, if I had made an ungodly amount of money in the markets and was still consistent..in the unlikely event I would disclose all my trade secrets and be truly philanthropic.....I wouldn't charge money...I would be making plenty of money from trading.....money from students would be a drop in the bucket..if I truly wanted my students to succeed I wouldn't be charging them tons of money for lessons..I would be encouraging them to build as much capital as possible. I donate a bunch of time to the humane society in my area, and I don't charge them for it...why? because I truly have an interest in the animals being treated humanely...no ulterior motives....I don't sell them discounted services.. (**"well, yes Mr Humane society director, I normally charge $40 an hour, but since I want to see your animals treated humanely, I will only charge $20"**)....nope I do it for free, because I am a volunteer and have a true interest in furthering my cause in an unselfish way. I am all for discussion of trading and helping each other out free....but seriously, no one in their right mind is going to give away their trade secrets... Same way the casinos do..they'll teach you to play cards...but you aren't going to learn anything of substance from them. The amount of money a trading edge is worth is actually priceless.....but it is surely worth more than any normal person could afford....It would be like me selling you a Porsche or $20....(rough comparison-lol but you get the point...it just doesn't make sense to do that). People don't readily train others to compete with them.

Donating free time for charity is much different than running a for profit business.

I would submit that teaching others a consistent trading edge for a fee has real value but not at any price. There is an inflection point at which the market--meaning the universe of potential students--wouldn't pay. Call it sticker shock for lack of a better term. And teaching someone your "secrets" doesn't mean they will have the same success as you. Successful trading entails more than learning setups--one has to learn to think like a trader and overcome many psychological obstacles, and many people have a great difficulty with that aspect. Most professionals will tell you that successfull trading is 80% psychogical and 20% execution.

With regard to teaching people to compete with them, in a highly fluid and liquid market like ES, this is really not an issue if the folks being taught are not very large block traders.

[Reaver]

I'm just sayin'.

....My point was that why would someone run a for-profit business when they make so much more at actually doing what they are teaching?

If I made a million dollars selling cars, Im not going to go out there beating the streets to drum up some clients to teach how to sell cars...there is no way that the time spent peddling my wares would be worth the time/money I'd lose from not just selling the cars in the first place.

But hey, maybe I am just crazy, it is a possibility.

[TRex]

	Quote:	Reaver
	I'm just sayin'. ....My point was that why would someone run a for-profit business when they make so much more at actually doing what they are teaching? If I made a million dollars selling cars, Im not going to go out there beating the streets to drum up some clients to teach how to sell cars...there is no way that the time spent peddling my wares would be worth the time/money I'd lose from not just selling the cars in the first place. But hey, maybe I am just crazy, it is a possibility.

And what I'm saying is it's not difficult to both trade and teach; after all, you're in front of the screen anyway and there long periods throught the day with "downtime" when the market is chopping or trading is very slow.

The passive income from teaching can be substantial by the way. Think of it as becoming vertically integrated whereby you can increase your profit margin at little additional cost. In this case, we're simply talking about a small amount of added time and the Internet provides a great vehicle to accomplish this.

[Reaver]

	Quote:	TRex
	And what I'm saying is it's not difficult to both trade and teach; after all, you're in front of the screen anyway and there long periods throught the day with "downtime" when the market is chopping or trading is very slow. The passive income from teaching can be substantial by the way. Think of it as becoming vertically integrated whereby you can increase your profit margin at little additional cost. In this case, we're simply talking about a small amount of added time and the Internet provides a great vehicle to accomplish this.

Oh I am sure it can be profitable. Of that, I am sure, or else so many people wouldn't do that instead of trade.

Why wouldn't one just trade on a larger scale and double their income instead of making peanuts (relative to their supposed trading profits)?

If the market is so large where it doesn't matter how many people trade the same way as you, then why not just double/triple/quadruple your trade sizes and go buy an island or helicopter or something with your newfound wealth?

Surely with the amount of money you could make from doubling or tripling your income since you already trade so well as to teach others, could even go into something as weak as a CD at 4-5%, (much less trading a few CEF's on the side) and the interest would be plenty as passive income....much more than some peasant young trader paying for lessons.

[TRex]

	Quote:	Reaver
	I'm just sayin'. ....My point was that why would someone run a for-profit business when they make so much more at actually doing what they are teaching? If I made a million dollars selling cars, Im not going to go out there beating the streets to drum up some clients to teach how to sell cars...there is no way that the time spent peddling my wares would be worth the time/money I'd lose from not just selling the cars in the first place. But hey, maybe I am just crazy, it is a possibility.

And what I'm saying is it's not difficult to both trade and teach; after all, you're in front of the screen anyway and there long periods throughout the day with "downtime" when the market is chopping or trading is very slow.

The passive income from teaching can be substantial by the way. Think of it as becoming vertically integrated whereby you can increase your profit margin at little additional cost. In this case, we're simply talking about a small amount of added time and the Internet provides a great vehicle to accomplish this.